Hard disagree.
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Are they spineless or is this just who they are? At some point you just have to think they have the courage of their convictions. And their convictions are hey, the insurance industry has a bunch of money.
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zikzak on September 12, 1962
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So obviously Iām mega disappointed that Warren retreated a bit on UHC (although it is accurate to say that a lot of you are acting like she completely collapse which is just factually inaccurate). At the same time Iām pretty confident she did it because she thought thatās what sheād have to do to get electedā¦ which is super depressing.
So yeah Iām finding this all depressing. I already knew that Bernie was clean as the driven snow and dgaf about getting elected if it meant compromising absolutely any of his principles. I still donāt think heād be a good president (partly because of what I just typed) so Iām still on board with Warrenā¦ Iām just deeply saddened that she was forced to go this way.
And obviously my fury at the people (interest groups, other Democratic politicians, etc) who forced her to make this move is pretty serious right now.
Because youāve got people who are so scared of losing to Trump, theyād rather nominate another god damn centrist than someone who represents the will of the people *cough..nunnehi
*cough..nunnehi
I donāt normally single people out, but heās hands down the single most tilting poster for me even though I advocated for him to return because I do think his posts add to discussion and his tireless work to produce factual data are worthwhile and admirable. But telling me I should just chill for another 10 years while we elect another moderate just really sticks in my craw
Not sure what your point is. Do you think we would have gone to the moon with the campaign āLetās go half way to the moon and maybe then weāll try to go the rest of the wayā?
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Letās get clear, Warren is now an apostate? A centrist Hillary wannabe shill, Biden with a bra and Indian feathers? Sheās probably going to announce tomorrow that billionaires will be getting a 2 cent a dollar wealth tax CUT instead, is this where weāre going?
No, but you could just vote for Bernie in the primary.
If she starts to tank a bit and Bernie starts doing better, sure.
Yāall need to get behind the Bern and start youāre M4all revolution with AOC doing the rounds getting senators elected.
Take a chance for once in your political life I say. 
And bring the fire of the Bern. 
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Sheās still my number two. Itās just not close now. Thereās not a lot of room between her and Yang, when before there was not a lot of room between her and Bernie.
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My point is that massive undertakings take years to accomplish. This affects 350 million people. This is not one of those āin my first 100 daysā projects.
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Its completely non disingenuous to say āin my first 100 days I will pass uhc that will take 5+ years to fully integrateā just like you know obamacare.
Fair enough, Iām more talking about I guess now former Warren stans who are jumping ship over this. Donāt get me wrong, I think itās a little shady what she did stringing some of you along, but she has other policies, there are other reasons to like her.
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Some of us have never wavered. Thereās a reason why I had Warren as my #2 and this is part of it. And letās not forget that because of the ridiculous debate structure and dumb ass moderators we havenāt even really heard her foreign policy positions yet. My guess is sheās a lot more hawkish than most of us would like
The bottom line is, she hurt herself a great deal by trying to play both sides of the coin on healthcare and it wonāt get any better for her (at least not with progressives) if she turns out to be hawkish on foreign policy. To the extent it helps her with centrists or Republicans who realize they made a mistake with Trump, time will tell. Thatās why sheās still my #2 if that happens
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Bernieās Medicare for All Bill in the Senate proposes benefits start 4 years after the bill passes.
Strategically, trying to pass a half-way bill first is probably bad. It may be less likely to pass and if it does pass it will probably make it harder to pass another bill afterwards.
But, Lizās commitment was already in question and now itās more in question.
I guess I could be on Team Bernie > Warren >>> everyone else. I do worry that salty-ass Hillary stans will stay home on election day because the hate the Bern so much.
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Dude Iām voting for Biden if it comes down to it. I voted for Hillary obv. But now is the time to pick OUR candidate. Itās probably the most control our side really has to shape the future. So ya itās important and just settling for shit and half measures is exactly how we got to this point.
Itās far from a purity test to strongly advocate for the candidate or candidates that get us the farthest.
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Never met a Hillary stan tbh. Certainly not on this board {or previous}.
There were plenty of Hillary stans on the previous board and some of them are here.