I donated to and volunteered for the M4A candidate. He lost and it sucks. Time to be a fucking grown up and get Joe Biden elected. I’ll probably be on this board ripping him relentlessly approximately .2 hours after he’s sworn in. Let’s get there.
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Grunching, but I think the thread title should be “LOL Democrats- How do you do, fellow socialists?”
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The Dems are so stupid with M4A that the woman running for congress in my district is having Biden speaking against M4A used against her in ads by the Republicans. The Republicans are using the Democrat nominee for President against a fellow Democrat.
Yeah, but the real discouraging thing is that once Biden stabilizes the ship and we get presumably get past the rona sometime in his first term, we’re going to make minimal actual progress before the country decides that it’s time for this national nightmare of peace and prosperity to end, bring on the next Republican.
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This x 1000.
I have been on the Bernie train since before 2016. I volunteered for his campaign both times. I donated several times. I dislike Biden. I dislike Pete. I dislike the way the dem primary played out. I am constantly fucked over by our healthcare system and M4A would be an insanely valuable improvement to my life.
I also want to be able to vote for progressive candidates again in the future. In order to have that privilege I need to make sure Biden wins. And so do you.
And on Jan 21, 2021 we start working to hold the Biden admin accountable.
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I hope you kids Pokemon Go to the Polls, if you know what I mean. ;)
Also pretty insane that people ITT want to outlaw the bomb maker jobs. What about the people who get paid to tell people to fuck off and die? What a bunch of commies.
What’s the nuance that I’m missing?
An eDem BSing about the facts of M4A, is flat out lying.
Trump BSing about the facts of M4A, is flat out lying.
Either way, we call out the lies and BS. Either way, we shouldn’t have liars as leaders.
The only bs about M4A is that it’s a lock it will be better than the status quo. That’s equivalent to the certainty of the anarchocapitalists.
Their position was: if everyone agrees with me and does what I want, everything will be awesome. Well, M4A will have to survive GOP sabotage after it is implemented, 50 different senators offering their input, the extra taxes needed. Having any kind of certainty what M4A will look like is delusional.
I mean, literally expanding the current Medicare would still impose co-pays, but when lefties hear that they just say they’ll get rid of them.
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I expect GOP(and eDem) sabotage attempts of policy regardless.
Advocating for M4A is based upon observing that other countries spend less and have better outcomes, so we could implement better policies here.
Comparing that to AnCap “philosophy” is comparing a thing that exists in this world to fantasy land.
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I’m with you almost completely, but I think it’s a mistake to say M4A will lower costs for sure, because it overlooks the fact that one political party’s whole ideology is founded on the fact that government does everything worse and at greater cost. They are completely dedicated to this idea at this point and it actually helps them keep power. They keep power despite the fact that in nearly every case they actively work to sabotage government services and functions and make them worse. You can rest assured that If we ever get M4A the Republican Party will devote a considerable amount of resources and effort into sabotaging it from the inside, and their constituents and some of the Dems/leftists will believe them. I don’t doubt they will figure out a way to make our system suck more and cost even more than any other country, because that’s the only idea they have.
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I’m in agreement with you and iron, that the GOP will do their evil-best to not allow programs to flourish that set an example of successfully lowering costs + providing benefits to people. But that isnt the (stated)reason why eDems are opposed to M4A.
Despite the Repub’s dedication to delivering profits to the oligarchy, I don’t see their opposition as a reason to cease advocacy for good policies.
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If Biden wins, 98% of Dems are going to disengage. MSNBC ratings will nosedive.
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Right on. And to be clear, my critique was more of a quibble with messaging rather than an opposition to the policy.
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Trump tweet parody itt
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Coincidentally, one of the “victories” of Obamacare was that insurance companies had to pay out 80% of premiums as benefits. Seems like we could abolish the insurance vultures and recapture the 20% copay right there.
I’m not trying to nitpick/debate whether your 98% guess as dead-on accurate. But what would your estimate be regarding what % of Dems disengaging after a Biden win compared to % that disengaged after Obama’s election in 2008?(assume I mean this kind of generically, as in a Obama('08)/Biden('20) voter ~= Dems)
Also, your mention of MSNBC ratings nosediving, made me think about how the media companies in general all have a profit motive that correlates to Trump 2nd term=more ratings and more profit. Biden win=lower ratings and less profit.
Curious as to your’s or anyone’s thoughts on either aspect.
I think it’s similar. A lot of the outrage about terrible things is fueled by how much we hate Trump. Progressives, let alone liberals, aren’t going to be nearly as fired up to protest anything that happens during a Biden administration.
There’s literally a thread about this and a few of us posted in it in depth, but people want to ignore it and act like none of us actually have any real opinions or ideas in that regard.
This is true to an extent but I think a lot of people will stay engaged on the issues that came to their attention that became important to them - BLM, family separation, etc.
Time will hopefully tell.