Even if we were all plotting to leave, which as you say the vast majority were not, so what! I mean, we are told that we are destroying the site by staying AND we are destroying the site by leaving. I guess in the spirit of community we are all supposed to stick around and get permed one poster at a time for the amusement of the “good” posters.
Jesus, at least Mat had the human decency to give us some time to organize before turning off the lights. If some of us want to advocate for leaving, we should be able to do it right here on the open forum and post links to where we are going. (Assuming we end up thinking it’s worth it.)
We weren’t PMing about how we’re just fucking with the mods and trying to piss people off. That’s the entire crux of the argument. You might disagree and think I’m lying about that, or just plain wrong, but once more, in italics, I fundamentally disagree with your premise that we were just fucking with the mods and trying to piss people off, that is the entire crux of the argument, and you shouldn’t state it like it’s an established premise.
Yeah, stating the truth isn’t some insulting go-to routine but I can see how it can look like that to somebody telling a lie.
It was a secret Jal doesn’t like Jman? I want to go easy with overanalyzing but it really seems like people thought other people were joking when they made their feelings know with plain insults in public. Some sort of bizzarro narcissism where you think even your enemies secretly like you or something.
The only person who was mentioned, and really only in passing once, that might be surprising is you. And you were defended. It was before I was in the thread.
I’m not trying to belittle you, I’m not trying to say you shouldn’t be hurt or offended or feel weirded out. Maybe you should. I’m just stating the other parts plain.
Well, this might be the point of friction then. I’m not talking about a srs biz rule, I’m talking about conducting oneself with some sort of decency because that conduct aligns with your personal morals and ethics.
To put a finer point on it, I wouldn’t make definitive statements about somebody saying something wrong in a thread I haven’t read because of some SPR SRS BIZ innocent-until-proven-guilty forum rule, rather, I wouldn’t do so because I’d feel like a gross idiot if I did.
Micro also created a site or at least a domain right? So that isn’t exactly what happened. Not sure how I could know that since you all keep calling me a liar and telling me I didn’t read it. Also for LITERALLY NO ONE WANTS TO GO TO SABOSITE there seem to be people posting there? Or is that really Sabo sockpuppeting every account?
I absolutely hate the term gaslighting but that’s exactly what you all are doing. You are trying to make me doubt what I read and how it made me feel. Did I read it all? No. I read the first few hundred posts though. I searched my sn. I saw others besides just jman denigrated. You aren’t going to convince me those things didn’t happen because they absolutely did. We can argue about if it’s really bad to do it. We can argue about the motives people had in that thread. But stop trying to convince me things I read with my own eyes didn’t happen.
And look I didn’t personally see @tabbaker or @6ix or any of the others I have talked to directly about this do any of the things I have mentioned. The usual suspects were the ones doing it. I’ve always enjoyed both of your posting and I don’t have a beef with you guys. I’ll say the same thing I said to JT, my disappointment is that people like you guys, who I respect, thought joining up with the malcontents was the way to solve the forum problems. I don’t get it. I don’t get why you continue to defend it. I seriously doubt we want different things here.
Anyways not wasting anymore effort on this. The bottom line is you guys made a lot of people upset, angry and distrusting of the Captains. If you don’t care about that, that’s fine. I’m not looking to start a years long feud with anyone here. Quite the opposite. So I will apologize if my tone is overly antagonistic. I am frustrated by this whole thing. Not because I was excluded but because this place is turning into a shithole and stuff like this is contributing to it.
This feels like the point in “Aurora” where the main characters get caught having a meeting, arrested, and dragged to the other side. The part where the ship finally steps in and gives power to the good guys. But there is no ship to step in, so we’ll just continue orbiting a hostile moon until we run out of supplies and slowly die off.
Micro said something along the lines of “I have an issue with getting domains I like so I got this one if it’s useful in the future” there was no secret plan, he didn’t do it because we encouraged him to find a cool domain we could use or any of that shit. Someone else mentioned another fun domain that was available and micro said he wasn’t gonna get it and none of us did either.
So the name of it was just coincidentally related to the project? I don’t remember what it was but it was something like nomods dot com or something. Seems odd that he just had that laying around.
Even if I take that at face value acting like there wasn’t serious discussion about leaving and who to take with you just isn’t honest. I mean when I searched my name there was debate about whether to invite me or not. And really there wasn’t much mean said about me so that isn’t my gripe at all. I also accept that most people in that thread were there in good faith to try and improve the forum. But let’s not pretend like that’s all it was or that everyone was there for that purpose. It wasn’t and they weren’t.
I’ll say the same thing I have said all day. I have no beef with you. This doesn’t need to explode the place. But just stop acting like there wasn’t serious discussion to do exactly what I am saying. Maybe it failed later. Admittedly I didn’t read past the first 300 posts or so. But there was definitely derogatory posting about at least jman, jmakin, boredsocial, wookie, cuse and others I forget just in the small section I read. There was definitely discussions on breaking away from the forum and who to invite. That stuff all happened. Does that make you evil monsters? No. But I’m not sure how we can even begin to discuss any of this with any of you if there isn’t even admission of what was plain for all of us to read.
If the responses we got to this were “this came from a good place, not every part of the discussion was cool but we never intended for it to be public” I think everyone would be pretty cool right now?
But instead it’s half of one side saying “how dare you have read our private messages” vs the other half saying “you didn’t read/interpret our private messages correctly” and just digging in their heels.
There’s derogatory posting about all those posters in the main forum too!
The best example I can think of this is when suzzer (not tagging him out of respect for his hatred for these threads) posted about how one of his posts was quoted in the clubhouse thread and a couple of posts were made in reply. Talking behind his back. But like, I said the exact same thing in the public forum! Except in the main forum I also told him to go fuck himself and got him banned for a day.
So yeah in some of the clubhouse thread we were talking behind some posters’ backs and that’s not a great look but let’s dispense with the fainting couch theatrics, right?
And in fact, the discussion about leaving was out of respect for this place. Like, don’t burn this place down, don’t cause trouble. If most people want permanent mods and vertical 2p2 modding, let them have it. If they won’t let us have an alternative, then we go build the alternative somewhere else.
My favorite thing so far has been people being criticized for not reading the entire PM thread in the ~12ish hours it was exposed to the entire forum, as if the top priority for everyone on Monday morning was to dig through 1300+ “new” posts and try to figure out what the hell was going on.
Why do you expect anyone not in the cabal to believe anything you say? It does matter that a select subset of the forum was judging people in private regardless of what they said in public. You all weren’t trying to make the forum a better place, you were trying to make the forum a better place for yourselves. Stop being so surprised when people tell you to fuck yourselves instead of thanking you for all your hard work in that PM.
People are being criticized for having strong opinions about something they didn’t read, kind of the way we made fun of Trumpers for talking about emails.
You can’t mischaracterize something you have not read and not expect push back.
I wish I wouldn’t of read them. I wouldn’t have to correct people who are either purposely being obtuse or lying.
And I thought there were some gross things in the PM’s.
I’m not going to try to tell you what to think or how you should feel, but does it cause you to pause or reconsider at all that a pretty smart cookie like Oreo says he read the entire thread and has a strongly different opinion of it than you do?
As far as remorse and why I don’t feel any: It’s because I feel just as betrayed and angry myself at many in the forum. And I didn’t post anything in there that I haven’t posted publicly in the past or would be unwilling to post now.
To answer about the talk of starting a new forum: I was one of the only posters in the thread that said we should just move on. It got almost no traction. I think micro said he was willing to move on, but wanted to give Johnny’s idea a chance first out of respect for him.
I’m truly astounded though why talk of leaving the forum is such a betrayal. I thought we were all ruining the forum with our shitposting and should either lick the boots or put on a pair and take a fucking hike? Do people want us to stick around and be punching bags for their amusement? (And don’t give me any condescending shit about how you want us to improve. Yeah and I want all of you to improve too.) Again, even Mat had the decency to allow us time to organize and disperse. Hell he allowed us to spam 2+2 with the new URL for months. I mean I would be happy if we get to the point of thinking we need to leave to hold those discussions here in a public thread, but we all know that it would get turbo-deleted almost as fast as lovemuffin deleted most of our critical posts at the ant colony.
You are being emotional and unfair right now. Those questions were asked because you named the thread “Unchained…… er Unthrottled”
Once Wookie understood what you wanted, he was almost overjoyed. The subforum would already be open if @SenorKeeed had simply replied “Yes” when Wookie asked if SK and the Captains would leave Wookie alone once the new forum was opened. That, of course, was a central part of the sell, once the Captains get their forum, they will finally accept that Wookie has the democratic support of us unwashed masses.
But of course no one can make things easy around here, so SK didn’t just say Yes and the thread derailed instead.
Still, there is strong support for the proposition you are pitching so maybe just focus on that?
Is everybody that failed to push back against what jmakin did also culpable? And BTW I had no idea that Chads was even talking about a PM until I went back through the PM to figure out what a few of you kept alluding to with the PM reveal. But hey at least I now know Ikes is truly Ikes.
