Yeah, I would argue we were both right.
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It seems clear that Warren believes what sheâs saying. I continue to think this is a case where Bernie suggested that a woman would have a tough time beating Trump and the argument is over how strong the wording he used was.
Warren comes out of this looking either scummy or foolish imo. Scummy if it was her call to leak this in the first place, as candid comments made off-the-record shouldnât be weaponized like that. Foolish if it wasnât her call, since she should have defused the situation. As I said much earlier she could have just released a statement saying âwell he didnât say that exactly, he said he thought a woman would have a tough time against Trump, also I donât think these private conversations are fair game for campaign materialâ. Regardless of the truth, this just seems like the obvious move politically. The innuendo about Bernie being anti-woman is out there and Warren looks like someone with integrity who isnât going to muckrake Bernie, which gives her moral standing when launching future attacks against him. Like maybe Iâm wrong and sheâll come out of this stronger politically, but right now it seems like a blunder.
Edit: Warren could also have made a statement âthe reported contents of the conversation are not accurate but Iâm not going to comment further because it was a private conversationâ which is vague enough to be true no matter what (since the reports are paraphrases/summaries anyway).
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Also, and Iâll probably take some heat for this, while I think itâs most likely that Bernie is not lying, I also donât care if he is. As far as Iâm concerned that would be fighting fire with fire. The counter to âyou called me a liar on national TVâ is âyou outed the contents of a private, off-the-record conversation on national TVâ. You want to play dirty, game on.
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If she believes it, I donât think she has it in her to say that reports are inaccurate. If she feels wronged here, I donât think she will sacrifice what she sees as the truth in the name of political expedience.
If she believes that the reports are accurate and she is never going to deny that they are accurate, how would you advise her to go about confirming those reports? She seems to have latched on to the strategy of âyes, they are true, but here are some more important issues that we should be talking about instead.â
From her campaignâs perspective, they may see this as them fighting fire with fire after the anti-Warren talking points script.
Iâd characterise that as foolish. She did Bernie an injury by revealing the contents of a private conversation with people who went on to leak the contents to the media. The lie would be to compensate Bernie for this injury. Thereâs nothing noble about refusing to lie under those circumstances.
By the way, regarding whether the campaign was the source of the initial leak:
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Sheâs not an instinctive liar. That may be foolish in this case, but perhaps says something about how she would govern as president.
I donât think there was any doubt about the source, but that does back up my suspicion that the attack was viewed as retaliatory in nature.
Warren: You think Hillary could win in 2020?
Bernie [shakes head]
Warren: AhâŚ
You are bad at reading.
If I were to say, in response to someone saying could a man walk on Mars, no, that would clearly indicate a man couldnât walk on Mars ever. The lack of temporal clarification implies perpetuity to those with basic comprehension skills. If I said ânot yetâ or ânot nowâ that changes things.
DUCY
This. They benefit from ambiguity.
d10 calling out ChrisVâs eminently reasonable, charitable, and what do you know! right posting as âshit postingâ?
What a damn hypocrite and dissembler. Heâs dyed in the wool for Liz at this point.
I donât think thatâs clear at all. Bernie might have said that a man might have an easier time than a woman, but I find it hard to believe his wording was any stronger than that. There is absolutely no way that the Warren camp is giving the media anything close to an accurate paraphrase of what the conversation actually was, and it is despicable to do this with a private conversation in the first place.
And of course CNNâs handling of this at the debate was totally absurd.
Itâs maybe the only thing Trump is right about: the media have no credibility.
Of course, his preference would be state media like OAN or some Russian propaganda shit and not genuinely independent media reporting facts and analyzing important matters honestly.
jesus christ SHE ORCHESTRATED THE FUCKING STORY!
It wasnât foolish. It was malicious.
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This is perfectly said.
Literally incontrovertible.
You can also believe someone and not be 100% sure.
I almost (not really) want to see Biden win the nom and name Warren as Veep.
And Warren stood by helplessly (donât ban me), as CNN gave her no opportunity to dispel the myth.
She disingenuously said I donât want to talk about this. And then talked about it!