Honestly I think your claim that the Russians are shooting their wounded was pretty bold, and including this or some other citation could have saved some trouble. I don’t think the word of a captured soldier is an especially reliable source, but it at least gives your claim some grounding.
3 Likes
10 people were hung at Nuremberg. Claiming those were all the Nazis who had genocidal aspirations is pretty much Holocaust Denial.
An official batallion of Nazis is still a pretty fair number of Nazis and I don’t think the “JFC” or the slurping up tankie propaganda are warranted.
People on Stormfront might say that. This post is the reason I broke my promise not to post for a while. If you said this in front of me there would be a fight.
4 Likes
it’s a bit ridiculous to say that i’m trying to make russians look worse than they are using that particular allegation. there’s a whole team tracking alleged war crimes against civilians in ukraine. if anything i’d go there.
even more lol to suggest i carry some bias against russians at large, since i identified myself as russian to all of you, and one the few people in touch with actual russians in moscow right now. although my post seemingly started this derail, the soldiers at time of war and eugenics arguments happened while i was put at beer trivia.
There’s one country in this war that is trying real hard to push nazi-looking iconography, has brainwashed Putin youth, is holding giant staged rallies, whose leader is talking about purifying their country, has shut down the last semblance of free press, throws protesters in jail for holding up a blank sign, throws bloggers in jail for 15 years for reporting the truth, who invaded another country in nothing but pure conquest, and is now slaughtering 10s of 1000s of civilians including deliberately bombing hospitals. It’s not Ukraine.
Sure Azov is a problem. But bringing up Azov in the Ukraine war thread that forcefully is the equivalent of the right flipping out about Hillary’s emails while ignoring Trump’s very real attempts to destroy democracy. One is giant mountain, the other a comparatively small molehill. I have faith that in a country with a Jewish president, the neo-nazis are not close to becoming a viable political force.
Putin’s entire propaganda justification for the war is literally portraying Azov to be a million times bigger deal than they are. The post I responded to basically mirrored that line.
Seems like the time to discuss Azov would be better when Ukraine isn’t fighting for its existence as a nation?
10 Likes
I might think the importance of when people on Unstuckpolitics.com posted criticisms of Ukraine were relatively more important than this stuff about Nazis if one of the people I quoted weren’t doing Holocaust Denial and the other weren’t straight up posting like a Nazi. UP is not particularly important to the war in Ukraine. UP itself does have a Nazi problem.
1 Like
I’m just saying that if you’re saying something new, you’re much more likely to be believed if you just include the citation. It’s not hard, since you almost certainly just read whatever it is you’re relaying here from somewhere else on the internet, and it’s just a best practice.
Now you’re being ridiculously over the top. NBZ says provocative shit all the time. What iron said wasn’t Nazi.
What Iron said was Holocaust Denial. Pretty classic. It wasn’t 10 people that did The Holocaust. I’m not suggesting Iron is a Nazi. He’s just wrong.
NBZ knew what he was posting and he knew it was straight up anti-Semitic Neo-Nazi talk. Whether he’s joking about it or not (funny joke), that’s what he’s doing.
3 Likes
I didn’t know about the extermination of slavic people until I saw the movie Victory. It could be true that American high schools do a really shitty job of teaching that for some reason. That that reason is to make the Holocaust more unique is pure BS and extremely offensive, I agree.
But I do think what’s happening now in Ukraine is pretty damn important. I think this could be a huge moment for the future of democracy (with all its warts and pitfalls). I see Ukrainians willing to die for what we have, I see immigrants who come to LA to sacrifice everything so their kids can have a shot at what we have, and it makes me less jaded about what we have.
As I’ve said before, I believe either a world full of liberal democracies or a one-world government run like China are the only two ways we ever get to Star Trek future w/o blowing ourselves up first. I don’t think Meirsheimer’s indefinite “stable Cold War” is realistic at all. No two modern democracies have ever gone to war. I feel like this could be a very pivotal moment to whether we go down one of those paths, or the path to blowing ourselves up. Ironically we may need to risk blowing ourselves up to get to the good path.
I’m following this thing fairly religiously and keeping the main Ukraine thread informed. If you follow the thread you know I’m trying very hard to only pass along verified or very likely to be true (with label as such). It’s not much, but if 100 people read my input to that thread, and influence others in their daily lives, that matters. If there are 1000s like me out there doing the same thing, then it starts to make a real difference.
So I do think UP matters. At least it makes me feel like I’m doing something, rather than just trying to put the war out of my mind.
5 Likes
micro is correct in asserting that some posts in this thread have been inappropriate/offensive (for a variety of different reasons). I think we all know that there is a subset of posters who are well-known for posting over-the-top provocative viewpoints that occasionally cross the line. Most readers by this point know that a significant “discount” should be given to those posts.
Oh yeah, one problem with my theory though. It’s hard to see a bunch of liberal democracies making the shared sacrifices necessary to avoid the worst of global warming. At least if our shaky democracy is any indication.
The enemy shooting their own wounded is almost always a lie. Leaving them behind alive puts a burden on the enemy because the Geneva convention says you need to take care of them so there is absolutely no reason to do this. Finishing off your enemies wounded is common though.
https://twitter.com/ksvarnon/status/1505902563186466817
thread
https://twitter.com/ksvarnon/status/1505905335919263748
https://twitter.com/ksvarnon/status/1505909465584836613
https://twitter.com/ishgooda_l/status/1505906907860680710
https://twitter.com/eastern_gooner/status/1505909024608370689
Still waiting for any examples or support for this nonsensical assertion.
There’s a history of people trying to defend the uniqueness of the Holocaust, from criticism of AOC for referring to migrant detention centers as concentration camps to Israel’s history of supporting denial of the Armenian genocide. The extreme version of this are those who argue that the Holocaust was the only genocide in history.
There is also a strand of thought that an emphasis on the Holocaust is sometimes used to distract from other mistreatment of people, such as that of Native Americans.
I think the Holocaust was unique in scale. Also, has genocide been official government policy in any other case?
Is the strand of thought you’re referring to here neo-Nazism?
The Cherokee worked together to stop this relocation, but were unsuccessful; they were eventually forcibly removed by the United States government in a march to the west that later became known as the Trail of Tears, which has been described as an act of genocide, because many died during the removals.[5]