Two things both true…
Biden and his administration are terrible on immigration policy. It’s their worst policy by far.
He is far better than the previous Administration.
If these two completely compatible facts tear this community apart we were not a community to begin with.
Explain what the realistic path forward is for say M4A? I’m not a revolutionary and that is ridiculous to say. Wanting progress towards the things other modern civilizations have makes me an extremist?
I voted for Biden, i supported him publicly and I want him to succeed.
This kind of ridiculous post is exactly what I’m talking about. It’s complete and utter bullshit meant to blunt my overall criticism of Biden and the people defending him on this forum. Some of you are fine just settling for the DemE bullshit and pretending everything is fine and we will “get there eventually”. Incrementalism has been a total failure and expecting me to just pateintly and happily wait another 40 years for a public option or else I am a revolutionary.
Jlawok.gif
I agree with this completely btw.
Eta-I kind of misread your post. I would say he is far better than Trump overall. Immigration/Border I would say so far he is only slightly/moderately better but some important progress has been made.
idk, I just see people who ultimately agree on end goals but disagree with me on tactics; it’s not irrational. Maybe we all just need to take the temperature down a few notches.
I won’t be able find you advocating not voting for Biden in a Biden versus Trump election right?
You are just mindlessly lashing out at this point, which is fine. It’s the expecting “thank you sir, may I have another” that is problematic.
And the border problem is a great deal more involved than just letting everyone go.
Why can’t we just have M4A? Because there are powerful forces who have everything at stake. So you have to successfully overcome those forces. That is the reality of it.
Just saying “it’s a no brainer most people”, doesn’t make it magically happen. It feels like a lot of the instances where self labeled progressives here get mad at everybody else and stand behind simplistic yet improbable solutions that fail to really account for the relevant problems.
At the end of the day, I don’t see how name calling over who is the bestest progressives accomplished anything here, but it’s where a lot of discussions end up.
I don’t consider myself a progressive or liberal. I do have views and positions that are very liberal and some that are very progressive. I don’t understand how fighting labels helps any particular discussion. There is no philosophy that properly covers right and wrong or the best way to accomplish goals.
So how about we slow are roll on talking about how poor the forum has become while blindly slinging mud and labeling people.
All these labels are not the least bit progressive.
This is pretty standard for progressives though. The right rallies around their shared goal of establishing advantages groups and gleefully punching down at other groups. The left gets in nonstop fist fights between subgroups about their differences. It’s one of the reasons that globally the right is winning and governments are trending toward fascism.
Maybe so. Because like you say we all mostly want the same end goals. I would guess M4A polls above 95% here.
My frustration and disagreement is with the general tone that seems to exist that we are making any progress towards our goals. I see a Joe Biden as an obstacle rather than a politician on “our side”. He is openly against many of the things this place has been for. Many here don’t share that view.
Blaming progressives for being essentially shut out of the “left” party structure for decades I am sure has nothing to do with this. If the shitprogs would just stop whining then Joe Biden, Chuck and Nancy would have already delivered the nice things by now.
You are half right though. The leftist parties being at war with themselves is the problem. But the war exists because most leftist parties worldwide are either infiltrated or controlled by the corporate stooge types who have no intention of real progress.
I would tend to agree with that. I’m not blaming the more progressive end of the left at all.
I always advocated voting for Biden once he was the nominee. You seem to totally misunderstand my point. If this place just becomes a place where we openly call posters shitprogs and defend abhorrent immigration policies then I’m done here. I’ve seen a disgusting amount of it lately. I see enough in the real world.
It’s important for anyone discussing politics to have a chin. I agree it doesn’t elevate the debate to use juvenile language, but sometimes you have to kick pigs in the mud.
This
But also this. I don’t think we’re actually there yet, but I also find myself leaving or ignoring threads when they trend this way.
Look I know Trump didn’t do it, but the President’s job is first to enforce the laws of the country. It’s not an accident that I’m absolutely horrified that Trump is walking around free right now. That’s because the actions he took as POTUS are a horrific precedent that needs to conclude in a public execution for all to see that it isn’t actually something you can do.
So yeah in that context I think Biden is currently trying to bring the goons over at border patrol and ICE to heel and they are probably resisting as hard as they can given how Trumpy they are. There’s a pandemic going on and people are sending kids across the border by themselves to exploit how our laws are setup to deal with that. (Not holding it against them, in their spot I would do the same probably)
It’s also been two months total and in that time period they’ve fixed the vaccine rollout and gotten a genuinely large COVID bill done… and now they’re putting enough pressure on the filibuster that Mitch is freaking out.
You can choose to see this situation as either half full or half empty. The half full side is that there’s a very real chance we do something resembling the right thing on voting rights and roll the GOP in 2022 adding even more actual progressives to both the Senate and House.
I get where you’re coming from, and I agree with most of the facts… but I think the reason you’re suffering so much is that there’s a pretty big delta between what you think is possible and what actually is possible.
Incredible
Which part. You are literally the biggest culprit of what I’m talking about so let’s hear a dissection of how this is incredible. 200 posts in a couple weeks and they are mostly terrible right wing drivel. What was your old/2+2 sn?
I think I’m suffering because I don’t see any real progress as possible now. Maybe after the GA runoffs part of me did believe they would nuke the filibuster and do some important things. Even just HR1 alone would be massive. I no longer believe any of that will happen.
Biden admin is actively working to place children with families stateside. That is a far cry from operating concentration camps.
Well, can’t argue with two pictures.
