Ya bad players really need to tighten up with KK and AKss. Passive lines with those hands win win win.
Most losing players would have better results if they switched to an overall tight-passive strategy. They wouldn’t be the best players in the game, but they wouldn’t lose as much and might even end up a small winner. They will win less with their premium hands, but they’ll lose a lot less with their other hands.
limon is a bit abrasive and probably not anywhere close to as technically sound as online pros, but he does have gobs of experience in the live arena in games like this so I’d love to read more of his thoughts on these hands. The example above makes a ton of sense and is probably not something a GTO pro would ever think of doing.
Forgot to add context. He’s talking about the KK hand where lolSklansky is advocating for a LP limp after 4-5 have already limped and hoping button or one of the blinds raises behind you.
limon is exactly right IME.
There are more games where Limon’s line is more EV than Sklansky’s line, but there do exist lineups where Sklansky’s line is better. However, S&M probably lack command of the English language to explain when lrr is better. It’s rare enough that I don’t think I’ve lrr’ed preflop in NLHE with AA/KK in 2023 yet. I understand the impulse to simplify the decision tree by just never doing it because you’re probably not losing a lot of value by avoiding non-standard lines in edge cases, but you are losing value if you never consider your full range of options.
I play in games where lrr is effective.
99% of the time the passive line is wrong. You don’t train new players on the 1%.
1 Like
I mean i haven’t read the book or the comments so i’m grunching here. but LRR isn’t a passive line. In my games where you play a very full ring and players don’t adjust their opening ranges it’s very effective.
I use LRR a decent amount but you have to be very confdent the raise is coming from your left.
Flatting 100% of range next in after an EP open is probably the biggest change I have made to my game the last 5 years and has been profitable as hell relative to just iso-ing a strong range in a high raked game.
2 Likes
As limon points out, the chance he will get to lrr in that KK hand is nearly zero. It’s passivity pretending to be a strategy.
In 99.99% of low limit games trying to limp raise preflop as a main strategy with the top 1% of your range is a massively ev losing plan.
I only skimmed the thread but I think later David is like “oh yeah that’s true but I’m talking about THIS game where I had reads” or something like that.
Lot of good those reads did, given that it didn’t get raised behind him.
I would have been so embarrassed to play that hand that way that never would admit after the fact that I had kings. I just would have lied and said that I had a pair of 4s and was hoping for a set. Instead he prints it publicly as an example of something?
On Thursday i limped AQ utg in a deep 10 handed 5-10 game. Spewtard monkey raised to 75 in mp as i expected. Got like 19 callers. I raise to 500. He made it 1250.
Folded to me i knew we’re in a leveling war and he had enough of my aggression. Dude plays with his ego first. Im way ahead of his range but rather pick up the pot so i shoved for 4k eff. Gotta push your edges.
He snapped me with kings and won both runs.
3 Likes
You play good like me.
1 Like
The worst part is he dusted off what was like a 12k usd stack at his peak but i ended up losing another 4k in kk vs aa spot against the biggest nit that i could have avoided (he only called pf) for my biggest loss of the year
I do honestly think that there are loads of strategies for “private” games. Meaning full ring super loose games where you need a pretty high vpip.
These games usually have multiple blinds because of straddles. I lrr relatively a lot of hands from the sb for example. I rather take a limped flop with AQ in the sb than to play it 7 way oop. But i’ll happily 3b an aggressive straddler if everyone calls and a huge amount of dead money
1 Like
Is Mason saying the point of that intro was to drive engagement by trolling?
https://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/showpost.php?p=58354260&postcount=254
Wasn’t Hustler advertising High Stakes Week with Keating and saying he’d be on most of the shows?
Now it’s looking like he’ll only be on 1 night with a meh lineup around him.
We deliberately released the dumbest most idiotic shit we could think of as a teaser for our book is quite the line.