Legal: estate shenanigans, need advice

Brother and Wife have same dad, ex-husband, early 30s.

Sister has different dad, second (ex) husband, mid 20s.

Relations were fine previously. Not great, not terrible. Sister has always been incredibly self-centered and ungrateful but this is taking it to a whole new level.

MIL lived in NY. Ex-StepDad (shady) claims he witnesses the signing.

If I had to guess, I’d say the alleged will is very likely to be legit. Unfortunately, it is the only will found and directly contradicts her dying wishes. The shadiness of the sequence of events that led to finding it has me skeptical that it is the only will.

You need two witnesses in New York. Is the other one the shady real estate agent friend, by chance?

I am guessing that shady lawyer drafted the will that he provided?

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The odds of it being completely fabricated are low. But that doesn’t mean it isn’t contestable. Since there’s a house involved I’m guessing the money at stake is considerable. Given the fact that you know that the sister is going against the mother’s wishes you absolutely have the moral ground to push any and all angles available, and you should.

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Thanks for that encouragement, that helps too.

It’s rural NY, so house is maybe $400k and total accounts, excluding life insurance, are maybe $300k. Not a ton of money relative to other estates, but still a lot of money. The principle of it is what has me so angry.

Sister liquidated ~$120k from those two accounts iirc. That + house + 1/3 remaining money + cars, she’s getting ballpark $600k and the other two get <$100k each.

Not sure about witnesses, but pretty sure shady lawyer drafted the will. He’s a real estate attorney afaik so estates/wills are maybe not even his area of practice.

Not sure if you are an AI guy but here is an AI response I prompted. Take it with the requisite grain of salt.

Not legal advice, but the key issue is: this is now probate litigation, not ordinary estate administration

Their options depend heavily on the state where Mom died / where the house is located, but Wife and Brother are not necessarily SOL. They need a probate litigation attorney in that state, ideally quickly.

Big legal buckets

  1. The beneficiary accounts may be outside the estate

Accounts with named beneficiaries often pass outside probate and are not controlled by the will, unless the beneficiary designation is successfully challenged. Cornell describes “nonprobate estate” assets as including life insurance, retirement benefits, jointly held property, will substitutes, and trusts; the ABA similarly notes that beneficiary-designated assets generally pass outside the will unless the estate is named as beneficiary.

So if Sister was validly listed as sole beneficiary on those two accounts, she may legally receive those accounts even if Mom verbally wanted an equal split.

Possible challenges: lack of capacity, undue influence, fraud, forged forms, improper beneficiary-change procedure, or Sister acting under a power of attorney in a self-dealing way. But those require evidence.

Confidence: High, as a general U.S. probate principle. State-specific exceptions can matter.

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  1. A photocopy of a will is not automatically worthless, but it is harder to prove

If the original will cannot be found, many states treat that as a major problem. Often, there is a presumption that the deceased revoked the will if the original was last known to be in her possession and cannot be located. But that presumption can sometimes be overcome with evidence.

So Sister may have to prove things like:

  • the photocopy accurately reflects a validly executed will;
  • Mom did not revoke the original;
  • the will was signed and witnessed properly under state law;
  • Mom had capacity;
  • there was no undue influence or fraud.

If the lawyers “won’t accept the photocopy,” that probably means they do not want to rely on it without the original. But ultimately, the probate court decides whether a copy can be admitted.

Confidence: Medium-high, because the broad principle is common, but the exact test varies by state.

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  1. No one is truly executor until the court appoints them

Brother being “chosen” by the siblings does not usually make him executor legally. A personal representative/executor/administrator gets legal authority when the probate court issues appointment papers, often called letters testamentary or letters of administration. Cornell summarizes that if no executor is named or able to serve, the court appoints a personal representative to administer the estate. Probate generally supervises collecting assets, paying debts/taxes, and distributing property.

So Wife/Brother can likely petition the court to open probate and ask for appointment of Brother, or a neutral third-party administrator, especially if Sister’s conduct creates distrust.

Confidence: High, generally.

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  1. The house is the biggest battleground

The house’s treatment depends on title and valid estate documents.

Possible outcomes:

Situation Likely effect
House was solely in Mom’s name, no valid will Goes by state intestacy law, likely split among children if no surviving spouse
Valid will gives house to Sister Sister may receive house, unless will is challenged
House had transfer-on-death deed naming Sister May pass outside probate, depending on state
House jointly owned with right of survivorship Passes to surviving owner outside probate
Photocopy will is rejected Estate likely treated as intestate unless another valid will exists

Cornell defines intestate succession as the state-law process used when someone dies without a valid will or binding document controlling distribution.

Confidence: High on the framework; unknown outcome without state/title facts.

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  1. The rings may be estate property unless Sister can prove otherwise

The rings are different from beneficiary accounts. Unless Mom validly gifted them before death, specifically devised them by a valid will, put them in a trust, or they were already Sister’s property, they may be personal property of the estate.

Sister just taking them is not automatically lawful. Wife/Brother should tell counsel about this specifically. The remedy may be an inventory demand, turnover request, estate accounting, or claim for conversion.

Confidence: Medium-high, but depends on evidence and state law.

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What Wife and Brother should do now

Immediate practical steps

  1. Hire their own probate litigation attorney
    • Not the “estate attorney” if that attorney is trying to stay neutral.
    • Search for “probate litigation,” “will contest,” or “fiduciary litigation” in the relevant state/county.
  2. File to open probate
    • If Sister has not produced the original will, Wife/Brother may be able to petition for intestate administration.
    • They can request Brother or a neutral third party as administrator.
  3. Object/caveat against the photocopy will
    • Many states have short deadlines once a will is offered.
    • They need to preserve the right to contest it.
  4. Demand preservation of evidence
    • Original will.
    • Drafting attorney records.
    • Witness names.
    • Medical records near execution date.
    • Texts/emails about Mom’s wishes.
    • Bank/retirement account beneficiary forms.
    • Power of attorney documents.
    • Ring/property records.
  5. Document the verbal equal-split statements
    • Names of everyone who heard Mom say it.
    • Approximate dates.
    • Whether she said it before or after the alleged will date.
    • Whether Sister was present.
    • Whether Mom was medicated, confused, lucid, etc.
  6. Find out whether Sister changed beneficiary designations
    • Being named beneficiary years ago is one thing.
    • A late-stage change during aggressive cancer may be more challengeable, especially if Sister assisted or isolated Mom.
  7. Check whether Sister had power of attorney
    • If Sister used POA to move money, change beneficiaries, retitle assets, or benefit herself, that can be a major issue.
  8. Ask the court for an inventory/accounting
    • Once a representative is appointed, estate assets should be inventoried.
    • If Sister has estate property, she may be required to disclose/return it.

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The strongest potential legal arguments

Wife/Brother should ask counsel about:

  • Will contest: lack of capacity, undue influence, fraud, duress, improper execution.
  • Lost will / copy will objection: original missing, possible revocation, suspicious production.
  • Petition for neutral administrator: family conflict and distrust.
  • Recovery of estate property: rings, vehicles, house contents, documents.
  • Accounting / discovery: identify all accounts and transfers.
  • Challenge beneficiary designations: especially recent changes, suspicious changes, or changes involving Sister’s involvement.
  • Fiduciary misconduct: only if Sister had POA or later gets appointed and mishandles estate assets.

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What probably does not help much legally

Mom’s repeated verbal wishes matter as evidence, especially for capacity/intent/undue influence, but verbal statements usually do not override:

  • a valid written will;
  • valid beneficiary designations;
  • joint ownership;
  • transfer-on-death documents.

So the verbal equal-split wishes are important, but they are not enough by themselves.

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Bottom line

Wife and Brother should not assume they are out of luck. The suspicious photocopy will, missing original, late-discovered beneficiary accounts, concealed information, and heirloom rings all justify talking to a probate litigation attorney immediately.

The most practical move is probably:

File/open probate, seek appointment of Brother or a neutral administrator, object to any attempted admission of the photocopy will unless Sister proves it, demand inventory/accounting, and investigate whether beneficiary designations or property transfers were changed under suspicious circumstances.

They need to act quickly because probate objection deadlines can be short and state-specific.

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I miss the simpler times when the biggest estate arguments were over a chess set.

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My mom was in the legal profession and it was crazy how many families who got along would completely explode when an estate came into play. It’s nuts what people will do for a little money.

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Thing is that it’s frequently not a small amount. Especially compared to whatever income level you are

There is no amount of money to fuck over family.

Is there anything documenting this? Even emails?

I mean, you have lawyers involved already, so, none of our advice is all that important, but seems like the sister has done some very wrong things (seems like stealing) if someone else is clearly the executor.

Sounds like this sister is just terrible and maybe just not really grown up yet, but a lot of this stuff in families is about old resentments.

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True, but my hunch is that fights over money are rarely JUST about money. Maybe some people opperate from a place of pure greed, but I think there are also a lot of feelings of entitlement/resentment/loss that get tapped into when someone dies and get played out in the form of fights about who gets to keep the childhood home or the fine china or whatever.

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Real advice: lawyer up obv and let the process play out in court. Full no contact immediately, the die has been cast. At least she’ll have to spend a bunch of money paying her lawyer too.

Keepin’ it real advice: Your wife needs to beat her ass. If my sibling literally stole a bunch of money from me they’d suffer some super unfortunate mishaps. You fuck over family for some bucks and you get what you get.

Sucks.

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If the will is legit and it gives the sister the house and a bunch of separate money, that sucks and I’m sure that’s a terrible feeling for your wife who would very understandably resent it - and not because of the money/assets. Maybe while still married to your mil, the youngest sister’s father was doing something to try to steer these things towards his child.

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fuck! what was that again??

i remember enough that it was an entertaining 2p2 thread but literally nothing else :smirking_face:

The search function is down so I can’t find the thread. I don’t even remember who the OP was, but I believe the gist of it was this:

  • OP and his cousin were co-executors of their grandmother’s estate.
  • OP’s father and cousin’s mother (the grandmother’s children) hated each other.
  • There was a snake draft to determine who got certain heirlooms. One of them was a fancy chess set.
  • Cousin’s mother got to pick first and was expected to take the chess set for one of her other children, but passed and took something else.
  • Something about that pick pissed off OP’s father, who took something with his first pick, and then in the next round took the chess set despite not playing chess at all, just to be a dick.
  • Hilarity ensues.
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Back on topic, IANAL and haven’t been through this myself yet so I have no advice, but DAMN, that sucks. You and your wife have my sympathies.

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thanks. hilarity did ensue

i have 1 brother and i’m 99.9% sure we’d always split whatever between us, and that 0.1% would have to be a really specific and weird scenario. he’s one of maybe 4-5 people that i would trust to not take a dollar more than half in that kind of situation.

for a couple hundred thousand extra i guess i’d hire a lawyer but i wouldn’t go overboard. then, and this i’m 100% sure of, i would never speak to or see whoever it was ever again.

they could be dying 30 years from now and i’d say no. my dad hasn’t spoken to my uncle in like 25 years. we’re a stubborn bunch. at some point when i was separated, i told my ex-wife the only time she’d ever hear my voice again was in court. i will never speak to that woman again.