“Please provide any advice.”
It’s like Charlie Brown having a lawyer send a letter to Lucy about how he should kick the football.
1 Like
I’m not even gonna get off the fucking couch next November. What’s the point?
Shots fired…
Xpost for AOC thread.
https://mobile.twitter.com/AOC/status/1175619319432196096
https://mobile.twitter.com/JamesFallows/status/1175620787820253185
https://mobile.twitter.com/AOC/status/1175624555974602753
That is strong.
3 Likes
https://mobile.twitter.com/sfpelosi/status/1175228252941504512
https://mobile.twitter.com/MrJonCryer/status/1175258386935369730
I mean AOC can say that all she wants. She should be leading a charge to force Pelosi to step down, if it really matters that much to her.
Remember the challenge to Pelosi came from the conservative Democrats–all of the more liberal Dems supported her.
This shit is annoying tbh because I don’t see AOC or any of them actually taking action here. Just a lot of talk.
1 Like
I’ve said before that I think Pelosi is right that impeachment is a bad move politically and I think this analysis is dead on. How much of the AOC/Pelosi rift is just a rhetorical battle with AOC and her allies stirring up shit about impeachment that they know will never happen and just gains them fans among the nunn.hi credulous morons who think that ANOTHER BOMBSHELL is going to somehow lead to impeachment and conviction.
I may have missed something contradicting what I’m about to say, but Pelosi alone should not bear all the responsibility for this. There are a ton of olds like Jerry Nadler (who would actually run the proceedings) or Carolyn Maloney or Hakeen Jefferies in very safe NYC seats who are terrible and should be primaried. They aren’t stepping out on impeachment or anything.
1 Like
Right. All the olds who actually run stuff don’t want to do the impeachment. Now, maybe it’s because they’re inveterate cowards who don’t have the stomach for Tough Political Action. Sure. Plausible. But maybe they don’t want to do impeachment because they think it wouldn’t actually accomplish anything and would be disastrous politically. And maybe they’re right.
God I love her
I worry too that it may be a bad move politically. But JFC man how long can they refuse to act before they’re not complicit themselves in bringing down democracy? Even if you don’t think impeachment is a good idea, the Dems have had the house long enough by now they should be much further along in what investigations they do have open and things like obtaining tax returns, emolument violations, etc.
This inaction is brought to you by the corporate establishment wing of the Dem party btw. FUCK CENTRISTS! Every Democrat who hasn’t yet come out in favor of impeachment should be primaried. Period. We need to take names. Fuck these people
What wisdom do the olds bring to the situation? Oh that’s right, they ~all helped Bill Clinton get away with being a corrupt, lying, sexual harrasing, racebaiting pervert. So now they feel like the Republicans will be able to do the same for someone 10x worse.
How about we just try doing the right thing, speak with integrity and sincerity, and let the chips fall were they may?
I mean, this was a pretty big step in challenging Pelosi.
This is ridiculous. Like, first of all, nunnehi has been in the trust establishment Dem leadership camp all along… He’s been all-in on their strategy and believes they’re simply dotting their i’s and crossing their t’s before they move.
On the topic of AOC, I don’t know what you expect her to do if you think this is disingenuous. First of all, she’s proven to be nothing but authentic and genuine so far. Second, if you do want to challenge the Speaker and try to force her hand, you don’t do so by starting with an attempt to get her to step down. You can’t overplay your hand, you have to build up some support in the caucus, apply pressure, and force her into a decision between moving on impeachment or facing the possibility of a challenge… At which point she can either call your bluff or impeach, and if she calls her bluff I guess we find out if you were able to get enough support for a real challenge.
But people somehow finding a way to say Pelosi’s approach is smart and correct, and AOC is disingenuous are just 100% wrong on everything. Pelosi is the disingenuous one talking out of both sides of her mouth.
5 Likes
Pelosi is the House Speaker third in line ffs. She controls the legislative agenda in the house. She leads the Dem caucus. It is absolutely reasonable to expect a leader to actually provide leadership. “Call your congressperson” is valid in most cases. It’s a cop out and deriliction of duty coming from her and her people.
Like, remember that time King George was being a tyrant and the Sons of Liberty in Boston were thinking about throwing some tea overboard, but instead they conducted extensive polling of the 13 colonies and realized that destroying tea was only polling at about 35 percent?
So instead they decided to wait until the next round of parliamentary elections in Britain in 1774 in hopes that the people of Great Britain would elect a parliament that decided to reverse their stance on taxation without representation. Their incredibly patriotic pragmatism was incredibly heroic, and that stroke of strategic genius is why we remember them still today.
10 Likes
I think that impeachment is an absolute dead end Pelosi has been pretty up front saying that she thinks the same. How is Pelosi being disingenuous? She thinks impeachment is a bad idea and is trying to block it.
She has repeatedly claimed she’s not trying to block it or slow walk it. She’s repeatedly said they’ll follow the facts where they lead and do their jobs in that regard. That was all incredibly disingenuous, because what she really meant was, “LOL, no, I’m never impeaching him no matter what.”
Bottom line: if they don’t impeach him, Republican presidents are forever going to be completely unimpeachable unless Dems have the House and 67 Senators. That’s a pretty fucking terrible precedent to allow. Impeach him, make the GOP carry his water, and hang it around their necks for the next 20 years. If it blows up in your face and we get authoritarian one-party rule, well, that’s the path we’re currently on anyway.
Let’s put up a fight and do the right thing and see how that strategy works for a while.
As I pointed out when the Dems didn’t move after the Mueller report, collusion with foreign governments was completely on the table for Trump in 2020 and obviously he was going to do it if he knew he could get away with it. Now he’s doing it, and they’re not moving again. You think he’s going to stop at Biden and Ukraine? You think he won’t enlist the assistance of Russia, Saudi Arabia, Israel if Netanyahu manages to maintain power, and whoever else he can find to help? It might as well be fucking legal, because there are zero consequences.
It’s literally Democrats vs. Trump and The World in 2020. And LOL at you if you think they won’t flat out cheat in any/every way they can figure out.
1 Like
Why do people act as if Clinton’s impeachment helped his popularity when his ticket went from 379 votes in 1996 to 266 votes in 2000?
1 Like
1998 midterms, the olds are deciding to let Trump be a lawless President based on a perceived short-term boost in a sample size of one.
But she passed a Republican health care plan with an overwhelming D majority in 2009 so Pelosi GOAT, ldo.
You can spin the argument either way, it’s basically impossible to say what the political fallout of that impeachment was.
Either way, I refuse to believe that the political consequences of impeaching Trump for any of his litany of offenses would have many parallels to impeaching Clinton for lying about an affair.
To be clear, what Clinton did was wrong and in a properly functioning political landscape in 2019 I would support impeaching him for it. But it’s nowhere near the level of what Trump has done, and nowhere near the level of something the average American cares that much about in their politics.
1 Like