Anyways, a bunch of Blue Dogs threaten to vote for McCarthy if Pelosi gives in to progressive demands. Now what?
What’s gonna happen if McCarthy is speaker? Trump won’t be impeached for his many crimes including those at the border? He’ll go on tv and claim to be feeding his constituents while also saying that 600 is a significant amount? He’ll green light Trumps military budget?
Oh wait that’s what Pelosi did. She should be out just because she is an enemy of the people
We will get a bunch of hearings on Hunter Biden and Republican claims of election fraud, so you’ll just be platforming the ability to spread conspiracy theory crack to a wider audience.
1 Like
No, in 2018 she said she was going to to a maximum of two more terms.
1 Like
Talking about how AOC should be messaging feels a bit like trying to coach lebron james at basketball. It’s a thing a very small group of people have any business doing and only half of those people probably should.
This may be true. But no one wants to drinks beer and watch sports with the guy who says this every game.
Also true!
How do you distinguish between AOC expertly biding her time and balancing goals and doing black belt level politics from AOC being co-opted by the corporate Democrats and being an ineffectual catspaw to create the illusion that some in the Democratic party are actually working to change things?
2 Likes
You wait and see what she votes for. Leave the soul reads for the better players…
Unquestioned stanning of politicans is for literal children and liberals
Like voting for Pelosi?
No not that vote, shut up.
2 Likes
Part of the problem is trying to define someone from one fucking vote.
She definitely shouldn’t have gotten mad at Bernie for touting Joe Rogan’s endorsement. I also think Matt Stoller is right that stuff like the Green New Deal and Medicare for All are performative sloganeering and that the important stuff is actually making incremental progress on concrete policy proposals. He makes the good point that “Medicare for All” could either be a horrible, corrupt system that sucks up 25% of the nation’s GDP or it could be a good, efficient system that takes up 10% of GDP. And if “Medicare for All” is applied to the current system, which is corrupt at every level, you’ll get the horrible Medicare for All. And if you actually address the corruption in the system, it matters a lot less if there actually is Medicare for All or not.
I didn’t say anyone thinks that the Democrats are actually working to change things.
My point was that it’s impossible to tell the difference between the AOC you describe and the AOC that that Jimmy Dore describes.
This is an incredibly bad post. Let’s break it down.
Post specifics:
Nobody in this thread, or anywhere on the forum, probably ever, has argued that politicians, or any specific politician, should never be questioned. So this is a textbook example of a strawman.
This is just name-calling.
This is name-calling combined with intellectually-lazy othering. I.e., in your mind, being a liberal is bad, therefore if someone does something bad, they’re a liberal. A textbook logical fallacy, which also fails to make any argument or advance any discourse.
Post context:
This post doesn’t explicitly relate to any post or poster in the thread, and it’s not a direct response to any post. So, as ggoreo notes, nobody knows who you’re talking to or about. With this post you’re effectively accusing the forum at large of “unquestioned stanning of [sic] politicians” and calling us all names (“children” and gasp “liberals”).
If you have something you want to say, it can and should be said without strawmanning and name-calling.
Let’s give it a spin. I’ll try to imagine what real point you were trying to make with your post, since you didn’t make one.
[ name of poster or quote of actual post ] is defending AOC’s vote for Pelosi for Speaker. I don’t agree that the vote is defensible because [ list reasons here ].
Doesn’t seem that hard to me.
8 Likes
Right but that’s a big part of how national parties co-opt people like AOC. She went from saying she’d not support Pelosi and having a sit in in Pelosi’s office to calling her Mama Bear and supporting her as speaker. Because once you spend a couple of years in Washington and understand how things work and get to know everyone as colleagues rather than just people you see on CNN or read about, it gets harder to do anything and easier to get along. I’m sure she wants to transform the Democratic party. But the Democratic Party also wants to transform her. And that’s how it usually goes.
1 Like
I’m not advocating Dore’s view or saying he’s right about the level to which AOC is corrupted by establishment Democrats. He’s just the one extreme on this conversation and the guy who started the whole dumb thing. The other extreme is the AOC can do no wrong guys, I love her, she’s so great. I think the truth is probably somewhere in the middle, and that in general it’s a hell of a lot better to err on the side of being skeptical of politicians rather than adoring.
He is getting makeup on that flag.
Why do you think the truth is in the middle? Do you have a reason to believe so or is it just instinctive bothsiderism?
I mean that strikes me as the general attitude towards AOC around here. You guys seem to just be on board with her 100%. If you’re actually more skeptical of her than that, my apologies.