I’m saying I want to run up the score for a moral message, not send one in defeat. But if we do lose, winning the popular vote by a bigger margin than in 2016 will still help with the (small) possibility of getting the electoral college reformed. (By small I mean very very very small, but it’s still non-zero.)
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Look, having nuclear — my uncle was a great professor and scientist and engineer, Dr. John Trump at MIT; good genes, very good genes, okay, very smart, the Wharton School of Finance, very good, very smart — you know, if you’re a conservative Republican, if I were a liberal, if, like, okay, if I ran as a liberal Democrat, they would say I’m one of the smartest people anywhere in the world — it’s true! — but when you’re a conservative Republican they try — oh, do they do a number — that’s why I always start off: Went to Wharton, was a good student, went there, went there, did this, built a fortune — you know I have to give my like credentials all the time, because we’re a little disadvantaged — but you look at the nuclear deal, the thing that really bothers me — it would have been so easy, and it’s not as important as these lives are (nuclear is powerful; my uncle explained that to me many, many years ago, the power and that was 35 years ago; he would explain the power of what’s going to happen and he was right — who would have thought?), but when you look at what’s going on with the four prisoners — now it used to be three, now it’s four — but when it was three and even now, I would have said it’s all in the messenger; fellas, and it is fellas because, you know, they don’t, they haven’t figured that the women are smarter right now than the men, so, you know, it’s gonna take them about another 150 years — but the Persians are great negotiators, the Iranians are great negotiators, so, and they, they just killed, they just killed us.
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Biden was constantly fumbling his words and was sometimes incoherently rambling in an almost Trumpian fashion. I genuinely believe he is not mentally fit to be president.
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I think Klobuchar was the only one that truly didn‘t belong on that debate stage. She added absolutely nothing.
I wonder what % of voters’ opinions on debate performance are decided by listening to pundits’ analysis of debate performance rather than actually watching the debate themselves? It’s got to be pretty high.
Obama’s former chief strategist’s take on Klobuchar’s performance.
https://twitter.com/davidaxelrod/status/1172349846994477057
She was very emphatic during the debate about the distinctions between her and the other candidates.
Problem is that she’s taking the worse position every time.
Maybe we deserve it if it ends up R v R after the last four years.
Obv I’ll pull the level but my god is joe an awful candidate
I’m in Michigan. I can’t not vote D (R lite)
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I’m not saying I necessarily buy it, but it’s certainly a plausible argument that we are better off with four more years of Trump than four years of Biden including Dems getting crushed in midterm elections and losing the House, and having President Tom Cotton disband our democracy completely in 2025. That’s the outcome of Biden winning.
Trump won’t actually run for a third term. He’s too much of a pussy.
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I think it was the right answer, and I think that it took until the third debate in the 2020 presidential cycle for him to disown Maduro is completely insane. I also think being in favor of keeping the filibuster is hugely disqualifying. I’d vote for him over Trump. In my head he’s almost as bad a candidate choice as Biden.
They guy is for all kinds of nice stuff, but has no idea how to get any of it done short of waiting for a socialist revolution. He wants to keep the filibuster and work through reconciliation. Being an impractical idealist with a slow but sort of accurate moral compass is not what a good president looks like.
EDIT: Speaking of Biden… I’m starting to convert to the narrative that the corporate media is owned by a bunch of massive corporations and they are in the tank for him. I can’t even believe I’m typing that lol. It’s so conspiracy theorish, but I just watched it with my own eyes. The guy has bombed three debates in a row, has zero enthusiasm from his supporters, and could easily lose to Donald Trump (LOLOL!!!) in the general. But he’s bought and paid for so they are for him I guess.
We pick Biden this whole country gets 4 years closer to systemic collapse. As results go it’s only slightly different/better than Trump getting reelected.
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I can’t describe how angry it has made me reading this stuff about the post debate analysis. Biden is going to be the nom because the media wants him to be, and reasonable people who point that out are going to be labeled conspiracy theorists or Bernie bros or whatever. This country is beyond saving.
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And for the record Biden clearly did misstate his health plan when Castro called him out for it. Biden supports a public option that you have to buy into. Somehow the topic of cancer came up and Biden says “all of those people will automatically be enrolled into the Medicare option” or something like that. Unless he’s got some weirdly specific carve out for cancer patients in his plan, those people would have to buy in just like everyone else.
It’s crazy how the moderators let these people conflate a public option that is the same model as private insurance (and in Kamala’s plan, administered by those private insurers) with a zero out of pocket m4a plan.
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Wasn’t able to watch most of the debate but based on the comments ITT looks like the big storyline was whether Castro was to mean or not to Biden.
You can see who’s sticking to the old-school debate playbook of sticking to the establishment points to impress the party loyalists, then looking to shift to the center after getting the nom and who’s looking to blow this shit up. Trump broke the old-school playbook by going crazy to the right during the debates and it got him a cult following. Bernie and Liz seem to have the same idea about going left.
What’s so weird about Biden is the whole “most electable” thing. There’s no hard evidence that something like that is justified. He’s said and done some moronic things in the 30 some odd years he’s been in politics that will come back to bite him if he gets the nom. As far as I’m concerned, the “most electable” argument is nothing more than a self-fulfilling prophecy. Somebody put out that argument, some people bought and now more people see him in the lead and add onto the lead.
But that’s starting to fall apart. People are going to start seeing that he’s basically Democratic Trump: an old, sundowning man who can barely string together a coherent thought. Only problem is that America’s main voting demographic has those things in common with Biden and Trump. To them it’s like one of their own is running for office.
The question is whether or not enough votes can be pulled away with either Warren or Sanders getting the nom. I’m not sure if that’s possible. To me, they’re splitting the progressive voters. If they wanted a progressive candidate in, the lowest polling of the two would drop out and throw their support behind the leader. Maybe that loser can get promised a cabinet postion (or even be a running mate).
I think some of the candidates are beginning to see that these debates are the Maury of politics and are acting accordingly. Castro’s owning Biden, DGAF Beto in action, Kamala getting drunk are all part of the show.
Updated rankings after last night
Top candidates
- Liz
- Bernie
Unlikely but would be strong GE candidates
3. Castro
4. Booker
Acceptable
5. Beto
6. Yang
Disaster tier
7. Pete
8. Kamala
9. Joe
10. Klobs
11. Everyone not on stage last night that hasn’t dropped out yet because reasons
I think any of the top 4 would be strong favorites in the GE, Beto and Yang would be a coin flip, everyone else leads to a Trump dynasty as the nominee.
If Biden is the nom and by some miracle wins, we need to start the AOC 2024 campaign to primary him immediately.
I’m in Idaho (Near reddest state).
Heard a bit of local AM radio and host was saying how Biden was the voice of reason up there. Everyone else is so far left they’re wackos (Sorry Klobs!).
The fellow right-wing caller laughed at him and said Biden is a fish in a barrel (and then agreed that everyone else is crazy left, “they’re so far left they’re up in the stands waiting for a 1000 ft homer”). This is Jeb all over again except Democrats are going to fall in line where Trump bucked the party and Fox until they came around.
Big if true.
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