All slavery is capitalism, but all capitalism is not slavery. Thus being anti-slavery does not make one anti-capitalism. It makes you anti that part of it.
Capitalists donāt have a natural pull towards integration, wtf that even means.
And even if you donāt mean it this way, every racistās first go to example against the idea of white privilege is āWhat about the NBA?ā
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I was literally thinking about Branch Rickey, but you do you.
I have nothing of substance to add to the discussion so Iāll give a personal anecdote. The issue of the historical interconnectedness between capitalism and racism has been discussed and debated for a very long time. When I was in graduate school I took a course in economic development which covered this (the course was taught by the father of someone this forum is familiar with). For what itās worth I wrote a term paper on the prevalence of pre-industrial revolution societies reliance on slaves and/or forced labor.
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Metaphorically speaking, when the tsunami kills everyone (including you), at least it wonāt be your fault. Thatās pretty much your position.
But meanwhile if Iām consuming more than you but actually out advocating for good candidates like Bernie or AOC with my time and wallet, whoās doing more to prevent the catastrophe? Whoās more to blame?
Thatās a complex question.
Iāve addressed this on numerous occasions in this thread. I think my ideas could work, I donāt know for sure cause weāve never tried it. But so far nobody else is advocating FOR a system.
You might have to be more specific, but Iāve already addressed this with regard to oil and plastic.
Wherein the guy who is clearly not reading my responses and proposals tells me to shove them up my ass. Go back and read them and address them or fuck right off.
Your idea needs that kind of buy-in to work. Mine needs 60-70M voters. Iām not trying to convince 200M people.
Obviously not, but I think we have a non-zero chance to reverse it if we act very very quickly. So do you or youād already be moving inland to higher ground and attempting to set up a survival bunker of some sort and grow all your own food. Instead youāre still in Cali, considering a move to the Vancouver area, right? You think youāre going to survive the iceberg there? Or are you just resigned to the demise of yourself and everyone you know?
From what Iāve seen the news is giving less and less time to the peaceful protests even as their numbers hold or grow. Peaceful protest can slowly create change, what is most effective over a 1-2 year stretch is an open question IMO.
I would guess peaceful because thereās a time limit on non-peaceful before the powers that be send in the tanks.
The Nordic system will never be adopted in the US because itās a society thatās always been based on greed and the cult of the individual.
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Letās pick this back up when it gets moved to a new thread. One of my closest friends who I have posted about was forced to go back to Saudi Arabia after getting a grad degree here, which was devastating to her because she loves America so much (at least what we should be/cold be). Last year I talked her into not giving up, and tried to get her to pursue Canada. She said no, she wanted to be in America, so she did the diversity visa application. 1 in 127 people make round 2 and a little under half make it from there. I didnāt tell her the odds because I didnāt want to bring her down, but obviously I expected disappointment.
She just sent me a copy of the email that told her she made round two. Nothing is ruining my joy for her today!
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History and theory say that in cases like the US today, they āworkā best together. See: integration of lunch counters c1960s (history), see diversity of tactics (theory).
First, the ongoing protests, even when the MSM loses interest in them, still serve the direct result of keeping police brutality down (outside of suppressing the protests), documenting just how violent the police are, and also of great importance: stressing if not bankrupting the police departments and local jurisdictions.
The bigger answer is every action builds upon previous actions.
Millions of people have taken to the streets. Tens of millions know them personally. Tens of millions just found out that the cops can be stood up to. Hundreds of thousands have been radicalized (at least). Personal connections thatāll last a lifetime in the communities of opposition have been forged. All important experience on the streets and jails has been learned. Communities have been founded.
Andā¦ itās worth doing for the sake of doing it. I really canāt stress this enough. These are the times of our lives. All those privileged enough should give it a try. Being on the streets and yelling āwhoās street, our streetāā¦ and it actually being true at that momentā¦ is a high you just canāt buy.
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And for as much as we focus on the problems here and what a mess we are, this 30 year old girl from Saudi Arabia who spent a few years here, and was even spit on here by a stranger in the streets, doesnāt want to be anywhere else in the world. I tried to talk her into Canada, but she wants to be an American, and help make this place better. So much so that she preferred a long shot here to a better chance there.
She just said to me, āIāve always considered it to be home, even when people were rude and aggressive to me. I love and will always love America.ā
Edit: she meant to say love twice.
I mean Iām pretty hard against a national minimum wage even $15/hour.
In Pickens SC 30 minutes from my house a living wage is like $7.00/hour and pushing even 15/hour would destroy their economy.
Not everyone lives in a big city. Those that do need to push this legislation on a local basis because cost of living in SF CA is easily 5x what it is where I live.
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Hey someone in the world has some hope, and they actually think that America can be made into a better place that more closely resembles its ideals, so much so that they want to come here despite being subjected to our racism and try to make it better. Lets piss all over them! I mean, sheās already literally been spit on here walking down the street, but sure step right up to tell her how wrong she is and how powerless she is to do her part to spark change.
Might as well shit on all of the peaceful protesters, too. They all think change is possible. Why donāt you go out there and tell them to get the fuck out of here, too.
Just as itās working folks job to organize as a class, itās the capitalists job to keep that from happening. The capitalists constantly need to be in a situation where they can hire one half of the working class to kill the other half. Otherwise no more capitalism, and the former capitalist are dangling from the lamp posts.
To exist, the capitalists must needs always divide civil society into buffer classes. It does this in many ways. Two ways will necessarily always be sex and race.
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Seems like you are arguing with Kendi since I was requoting the passage you posted from his book where he says capitalism (at least as people like Liz Warren use the term) might not be inextricably linked with racism.
I donāt know an example of a capitalist society that doesnāt have racism. But then again I donāt know an example of any modern society that doesnāt have racism.
We should continue this in another thread another day, but I think one potential starting point is discussing whether there is any country in the world that we think is a good example to emulate.
Iām talking about that wing of the party, which I believe will take power in this country if we still have a functional democracy in 2024-2028. Bernie fueled AOC. AOC has more power within the party now, at 30 years old, than Bernie had until he was probably 73 or 74ā¦ and she can keep building.
And I know youāre part of a family of immigrants, and I donāt think nihilism is a good philosophy to have politically. I mean, Iām not sure it leads to the conclusions you want, certainly not for most people.
This country has made big leaps forward in the past, and weāre either about to do so or collapse on ourselves. As long as thereās a chance of a big leap, I think we should all go for it, not just sit around and watch the collapse while holding our hands up saying, āDonāt blame me, I didnāt do it!ā
We still wonāt be perfect, but thereās no such thing. If you took away the vote from everyone over 50 in this country, weād probably be pretty close to actually being USA#1 again within 10-15 years. The question is whether we can white knuckle it through these stacked crises and get to the point where the current under-50 population is enough of the voting population to dictate policy. Whether or not weāre still a functional democracy is a big question, but itās not over yet.
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I donāt know, I think this thread proves that we need to agree on what is wrong before we can talk about solutions.
You mean capitalism, right?