I didn’t say I was a pacifist. I’m not. I’m actually against things like invading Iraq and supporting the Army of Conquest and supporting the attack on Yemen because I think it means fewer people will be killed. Being part of an international peacekeeping force on the Syria-Turkey border would be the right thing right now.
I didn’t say you were a pacifist either, but Tulsi “end regime change wars” seems to be emulating somebody who cares deeply about people not getting killed, but then you factor in she is totally totally cool with anybody on the planet killing Sunni Muslims, and also I assume cool with whatever Russia has done/is ultimately going to do in Eastern Ukraine, whatever el-Sisi did in Egypt (regime change coup that she seems to have liked), I can’t help but call her on her contradictions.
FWIW, it’s probably best to let Putin, Erdogan, and Assad work it all out now. Peace keeping force would do/mean nothing.
If someone reasonable were in command then it would be better for us to put 1000 troops at the border, enforce a no-fly zone, and work with an international force. If you just asked me, should we send in some troops under Trump’s command? I’d have to say no. Putin and Assad are better partners for the Democratic Federation of Northern Syria. I’m not sure that calculation would be different for, say, Biden.
For the record (if the takes of a random internet guy deserve one), to the best of my ability with respect to what I thought at the time:
American interventions/non-interventions since 9/11 in the ME:
Afghanistan: yeah
Iraq 2 invasion: fuck no
Iraq 2 surge (Petraeus): at the time, fuck no, in retrospect, not quite as sure, it was reasonably successful
Iraq 2 withdrawal: at the time, fuck yes, in retrospect, mostly fuck yes but see Rise of ISIS
Libya: generally unsure, Obama was really selling some imminent massacre in Tripoli or Benghazi, felt like a Kosovo situation (in favor), but if that was all propaganda fair enough, so in retrospect, pretty bad
Syria: generally unsure, in retrospect, no clue
Rise of ISIS: felt like Obama should have intervened way sooner in Iraq/Syria ~like about when he said they were the JV team; if they had really tried to negotiate keeping a small force prior to withdrawing that may have been good, again in retrospect
Iran deal: Happy dance, fuck yea
If I’m missing anything lmk I’ll be happy to tell you
I gotta go to sleep. We should not have done nothing in Afghanistan, but we shouldn’t have done what we did. Bombing shit and assuming we’ll just fix it in post doesn’t work*. And we had the opportunity to address Al Queda without destroying the existing order when there was nothing to take its place.
*ok, maybe Germany and Japan, but not only were we not making that kind of commitment, I think it was crucial that we actually were the good guys and that they started it.
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How is the US responsible for Assad killing his own people?
I think Obama should have prioritized removing Assad over fighting ISIS and perhaps approved any CIA plan to more directly oust him instead of trying to force him to step down.
We should of put more pressure on England and France to end their evil colonial ways…
Aside from invading Iraq and creating a hotbed of extremist militants, and aside from our initial support of what for all of six months or so in 2011 looked like a rebellion in the Syrian Army, we spent years militarily supporting a hodgepodge of groups, many of which were Al Queda or ISIS affiliates, fighting a civil war with neither the military capability or popular support to overthrow the regime, let alone put anything in its place.
Which other countries should we do this to/for? Should we jump on the chance to ship weapons to any insurgent groups in North Korea? Egypt? Turkey? Should we “help” the Kurds in Turkey by sending the PKK RPGs and M16s?
What about Iran? Why is it good that we negotiated with the horrible regime in Iran instead of supporting insurgents there?
https://twitter.com/jmartNYT/status/1186625799346110465
Anyone know what Michael Dukakis is up to these days?
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Who the fuck is calling up Sherrod and asking him to give up his senate seat for a wh run?
Hey I was on Facebook back when you had to have a .edu email address to join. Can I be ambassador to Somewhere Tropical?
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You’re skipping the part how the Syrian civil war started which had absolutely nothing to do with the US, Iraq or ISIS. The Syrian people after living in a brutal dictatorship for decades demanded democratic reforms. Assad used the military to try to quash the protests.
Once the civil war started the West should absolutely have supported the Democratic forces in Syria to help oust the Assad regime.
There is no one we could support in NK but if there ever was a situation then yes. The existence of the state of North Korea is a huge failure for civilization. I am afraid now it is too late for any solution except to condemn millions of Koreans to decades of slavery, oppression and misery.
I see you keep editing your post to add more countries. There are no civil wars in any of the countries you mentioned but again yes, if there are we should support those who fight for freedom. I understand that it will not always be clear who that when the chaos of battle is raging.
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Is the Army of Conquest in Syria fighting for freedom?
We should support groups that are the good guys, have a decent chance at prevailing, and have popular support. Eight years ago for a matter of months it may have looked like that in Syria.
Syrian uprising may have stood a chance of forming a unified democratic opposition if it weren’t for this:
The jihadists exploited the chaos and divisions within both Syria and Iraq.
IS grew out of what was al-Qaeda in Iraq, which was formed by Sunni militants after the US-led invasion in 2003 and became a major force in the country’s sectarian insurgency.
In 2011, the group joined the rebellion against President Bashar al-Assad in Syria, where it found a safe haven and easy access to weapons.
Probably not. Why?
I amnot sure what you are trying to say here in regard to the question if the West should have supported the democratic forces in Syria.
They aren’t. Because we support them and I wonder if you think we should. They are fighting Assad.
The only democratic force in Syria is the SDF and we should support it. It meets all the requirements. They are the good guys (not perfect, but they’re better than us). They have demonstrated that they have the ability to hold territory and govern with popular support. There is (was?) a very realistic chance of some measure of success in forming a stable autonomous region. And they haven’t been fighting the Assad regime.
Loius,
Should we arm and provide direct military assistance to this group?
If not, why?
The establishment is probably freaking out that Biden doesn’t look like he’s going to win, and right now the other front runners are for Medicare for All and a small-town mayor. They probably find Brown more acceptable than Liz and Bernie.
There’s like four other centrists in the race who can step up if Biden has a stroke or something.
I don’t know anything about this group except what I got from skimming the wikipedia article. I don’t know much about Army of Conquest either. So here is my generic response:
Regime change isn’t the end goal. The end goal is to a democratic government replace the oppressive current regimes. Replacing it with another oppressive regime obviously defeats the purpose.