Ukraine, Russia, and the West

I think if we want to consider scenarios where Putin has a big plan and is still acting rationally (but obviously monstrously), it probably involves connecting Crimea to the DPR, LPR, and Russia, and absorbing it all officially, and trading that for ending the war and letting Ukraine into the EU and NATO but with no foreign troops based there.

That could be an exit ramp, and if he can take Kyiv he might be able to get all of that in a trade for it.

I’ll note that their gains have primarily been in the South, and perhaps that’s why - maybe the best units are being sent there.

But that idea doesn’t jive with the profile of his thinking wherein he wants all the old USSR territory back. But if he thinks that’s possible he’s not a rational actor.

Weird. I hear r in about half of the examples and not in the rest.

Good summary in this thread of who Putin is and what he’s done.

https://twitter.com/DAlperovitch/status/1498189698858205184

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I don’t think there is any scenario short of military defeat or internal revolution where he will let this happen.

The scary part is the first part could come right out of a right wing fever swamp.

https://twitter.com/phildstewart/status/1498258644173004807?ref_src=twsrc^tfw|twcamp^tweetembed|twterm^1498258644173004807|twgr^|twcon^s1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.redditmedia.com%2Fmediaembed%2Fliveupdate%2F18hnzysb1elcs%2FLiveUpdate_63d38316-988a-11ec-81e2-6e7447119986%2F0

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FYP

yes, they would be very welcoming to the Honduran refugees that made it through the machine gun nests and aligator-filled moats on the confederate/mexican border and the slave patrols all through the interior

seriously, beyond the obvious hyperbole, this is deluded. shitlibs hate (southern, brown) migrants nearly as much as the GOP

The English pronunciation is KEY-ev. It’s pronounced differently in Ukrainian, which is a different language than English.

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The point is that people are trying to understand how it’s pronounced in Ukrainian.

The “English” pronunciation comes from the Russian pronunciation. Russian is also a different language from English. Attempting more authentic pronunciation is a sign of respect for other cultures, in line with a desire to oppose colonialism, imperialism, and cultural appropriation.

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It’s more like Keev or KEY-iv but with the “i” part way less pronounced than we would be used to when reading KEY-iv

We could really get into the weeds on this, and I don’t want to trigger a big derail, but I think what we’re looking for is the proper pronunciation in English that a Ukrainian who also spoke English would use, if that makes sense.

Like we don’t call Spain Espana, or Mexico Meh-hee-coh. We don’t call Germany Deutschland, etc. But someone from Germany or Spain who speaks fluent English, in America or in the UK surrounded by English speakers would probably not use Espana or Deutschland either.

Right, the Russian → English spelling is Kiev, the Ukrainian to English spelling is Kyiv. So key-ev would be a pronunciation that derived from the Russian → English translation, whereas key-iv or keev would derive more from Ukrainian → English.

That’s my understanding based on research over the past week.

The discussion we’re having would be akin to the Mos-cow vs. Mos-coh pronunciation of the capital of Russia. When in Russian it would be Mosk-vah, but nobody speaking English uses that.

I think we should rename Kiev “Wellington City” or something like that.

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SenorKeeev

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it was definitely Kiev when I played the board game Risk when I was 10.

edit - googling now maybe im wrong

Now that we’re making progress on getting the pronunciation of the Ukrainian capital, anybody know how to pronounce the name of that country south of Texas?

This topic is incredibly germane to the war. Using the Russian pronunciation or referring to it as the Ukraine helps Putin’s narrative that Ukraine is not a real country, but one manufactured by the Bolsheviks catering to identity politics. Calling it “Kyiv” is an act of recognizing that Ukraine is and ought to be a sovereign nation.

The derail could come from me pointing out that this is political correctness and that it is a good thing, throwing it in the face of anyone who whines about PC and cancel culture (which Putin also whines about).

Love how a spinoff thread was made so as to not clutter this one up and keep it strictly news, great job guys

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I don’t think there are any city names in Risk.