Let the GOP run on hating trans people and ignore them while you talk healthcare/education.
The IOC has fine rules on this. I’m not educated on how the NCAA deals with the issue, I’m guessing it’s not as stringent and that’s all the change that’s needed.
BUT HOW ARE WE GONNA PAY FOR IT!?!?!
I’m with you. Having said that, I think that politically an approach of scolding people for their anti-trans ignorance is going to play right into the hands of Republicans that want to make this a wedge issue. Your post is a good post, because on this forum the vast majority of posters will likely take it to heart and try to get more educated. But out in the “retail” politics world, we really need a set of simple talking points to explain why trans women should be allowed to compete in women’s sports. Although it may feel self evident, we will need the ammunition to win over people. I think facts are in the favor of inclusion here, so it’s worthwhile to bring them into any conversation on the topic. It never hurts to refresh people on the fundamentals.
It is very much this, a couple people immediately chime in about losing votes any time this subject comes up.
I will absolutely acknowledge the difficulty of addressing the sports issue. But Jesus Christ, we talking about sports. I don’t feel safe traveling to a large number of states with my child anymore, and people are talking about backing off of trans rights because of sports.
Only in the sense that it makes you human. It’s natural to be emotionally and reactively protective of your children and want them to succeed.
I would just encourage you to try to be less emotionally charged about it (realizing this is hard) and go where the facts and data take you. Logic, reason, and rational thinking should always be the default. We also know and understand that a lot of the emotional appeals about this from the right are misdirections - as always, their real agenda is driven by hate, not “protecting women’s sports”, and a clear headed examination of the facts bears that out. The same people driving anti trans narratives in sport are the ones that want to put teachers in jail for talking about the gays.
I acknowledge the issue is complex, but complex problems demand complex solutions. Banning trans women from sport is a simple solution to complex problem, and it comes with so much baggage it’s definitely not a good solution. Look for solutions that have inclusiveness at the core.
Sports are important in America. It’s a screen on which a lot of social ideas are projected. Look at the racial attitudes toward players, or the militarization of the NFL. Sports are a big part of the social fabric, even if it “objectively” is a bunch of guys running around in a field in their pajamas.
Parents trying to achieve fairness for their children does not make them “anti trans.”
I feel like some of you are attempting to make this solely about the worst politicians because frank talk on how it works on the ground level will force you to look at your own dissonance.
But the sports issue isn’t “political” in that it should be solved by politicians. What the NCAA, IOC, FIFA or whatever do should not be what a politician says and I really doubt any politician is going to give any helpful suggestions in this area.
It depends. That’s what makes it politics.
On my part, I have a lot of interest in polling and public opinion, so I am interested in accurately describing the shape of public opinion on this and other issues. So, I think stuff like this is useful to know.
https://twitter.com/MorningConsult/status/1504321631656689665?s=20&t=SoTbma-ZxogxcTxqiFbskw
I don’t think most here would argue against outright not supporting trans rights, but there’s a legitimate question about how much of a priority should be placed on such issues. It’s part of the debate over whether Democrats spend too much time on identity politics and not enough on broader economic issues.
If the only fairness that they’ll accept is that trans people don’t get to play, it sure as hell is anti-trans.
Has anyone made that claim?
Chief’s Planet? Come on, Oreo. I see where you’re coming from, but I can assure you that this discussion would have been a lot worse over there.
Also, unlike CP, you have a persuadable audience. If this disturbs you so much, perhaps you could start a thread on the subject and lay out your position. It is clear that many here would be interested (in a good way) in that.
Shocked to see this slur used here. What is this, the Jive Turkey forums?
That’s fine but there are levels of anti-trans. For example, do you think that it is reasonable to lump Riverman in with the typical CP poster. If every anti-trans person were only as anti-trans as Riverman, the lives of trans people would orders of magnitude better than it is now.
You’ve come into this thread swinging at trans people before spending time to read up on the issue. So, maybe no, you arent as fucking ready to listen as you think you are.
“Fairness for their kids”
Yeah. The fainess issue here is some high level athlete who might come 4th instead of 3rd at a meet because someone swam better than them. Not a bunch of kids being bullied out of sport all over america. Fuck off with this shit.
There’s more than one way for an XY person to come out with a female body plan, to look plainly female, to have typical female hormone levels, and to otherwise never have the slightest idea that she had anything intersex about her until a karyotype assay. Seems pretty rude to force such people to compete with males. Not only that, if the standard is going to be genetic analysis as a prerequisite for participation in sports, that’s going to open up a whole lot of paternity cans of worms.
So. By “letting the sports issue go”
What are you suggesting?
All trans kids, already socially excluded and bullied at higher rates, just stop playing sport all over the world?
How about putting up with trans and intersex kids having their genitals discussed by adults at sports day? That’s cool with you?
Trans people just walk past the sports issue being used to dead name and misgender athletes while painting them as the bad guys?
Yeah. Maybe. Let’s just let this one go.