I think this kinda hits on what foreign centrists just really don’t get about our system. Nearly every American over 30 has experienced some persistent pain which lead to multiple doctors/imaging appointments over the span of several weeks, each costing a couple hundred bucks, only to be told that it’s not really a big deal.
We’re not going to be able to fix the system by making small changes, and it’s not great when having insurance produces this result.
When I started having to pee a lot at night about age 30, I had a urologist do every horrible test you can imagine and some you probably can’t. End result? ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
If I had a high-deductible plan back then and I was nowhere near the deductible I would have thought long and hard about it. But then again - might have bladder cancer or something.
Yea it’s really sick how perverse the incentives are to do any preventative care when you have lousy high deductible insurance. Paying $1000+ out of pocket for some basic tests for a mildly worrying condition is brutal, and you know it’s gonna be nothing most of the time. I won’t do it and neither will most people. Fortunately I travel a lot (or did) and can get stuff done in countries with decent healthcare for a fraction of US prices. Right now I’m paying $350/mo for the privilege of not using my healthcare. But if I get cancer at 35 I should be covered!
I don’t want to stan for USA#1’s health care system, but I don’t even understand the complaints here.
So, you’re saying if a doctor does an extremely thorough investigation and finds a bladder cancer, then the cost is fine, but if the doctor does that exact evaluation and finds no cancer, then the cost is ridiculous? The cost of the tests has nothing to do with what they do or don’t find is wrong with you.
And if what you’re saying that the cost is ridiculous in either case, then it doesn’t matter whether they actually found anything or not. That has absolutely nothing to do with your complaint.
And if you get legit sick there’s a good chance you go bankrupt anyway.
These ‘low cost’ high deductible plans used to cover you at $5000. The deductible seems like has been going up a $1000/yr AND getting more expensive. It takes a lot of tests for a healthy person to get anywhere even close to $8500. And if you don’t think you’re gonna be close you’ll pay for stuff without insurance for half the cost. So it might take you a few thousand in tests w/o using insurance to realize its something serious and then it’s time to switch over to insurance. So at that point you’ve paid well over 10k before insurance would kick in. Lovely.
The complaint is it’s extremely expensive to pay out of pocket for all these tests, so people who are on high deductible plans aren’t gonna be catching cancer early a lot of the time bc they’re not gonna fork out that money for something that is prob nothing.
Also it sucks having to choose to pay an inflated price and get to go towards your deductible or pay half that and don’t use your insurance.
If the tests cost what they cost in Mexico, it would be no big deal to get them done. If the tests cost $5000 and are very likely to come up with nothing, then maybe you think twice about it. I’m not sure if my urologist would have ordered up or even recommended the works at the time if I was uninsured.
When I got a wisdom tooth pulled I got the hardest sales job ever to get all 4 done, including on the operating chair after I’d already said no in the office multiple times. The orthodontist kept mentioning that insurance would cover all 4. I think he saw it as leaving income on the table. I never had any problems with the other 3 and still haven’t to this day. The surgery and recovery for one was a nightmare. I’d hate to have gone through that x 4.
Just saying it’s not always that simple. Which actually is what the high deductible is literally designed to do - at least make you think about it and why the ACA pushed them. Whether or not that’s a good policy is up for debate. But zero cost medical care to the patient was cited as a reason for skyrocketing costs in the ACA reasoning.
In CSO4’s case, he knows he needs the ultrasound. I don’t know if I really needed the toilet snake up the pee hole or if every urologist would have recommended it for something that happens to many guys (having to pee in the night) if age 30 was a little early onset. He also kept insisting I might have a bladder infection and putting me on antibiotics - even when I went back to him 12 years later. Yeah that’s it. Also I know damn well I didn’t need the 4 wisdom teeth pulled.
I realize I am now arguing a completely different point than I started. But the bottom line is medical care should be cheaper. Maybe not free, but reasonable.
Ok, so it sounds like you’ve got one complaint the tests are expensive.
You could have a secondary complaint that some of the tests are unnecessary. I’m not sensing that, though.
But if they are necessary based on the symptoms you are having then whether they find anything has nothing to do with the problem you have.
If you’re saying the doc is ordering unnecessary tests based on your symptoms, that’s a legit gripe. I didn’t realize that.
However, this whole issue of removing the issue of cost should cut both ways. Your doctor should not order an unnecessary test because it makes them more money. They also should not order an unnecessary test because it is cheap or free for you, even if there is no medical reason to do so and is really just going to reduce your anxiety.
I agree but in the real world doctors are trying to make money. If they see something is completely covered with no skin off the patient’s back, and it’s not something they see as causing any risk to the patient (other than discomfort), they may lean towards doing the thing that makes them more money in the long run. Upton Sinclair quote, etc.
That was the theory behind higher deductibles - at least put some resistance on that stuff. But cheaper medical care seems like a much cleaner solution.
Really? That wasn’t clear at all to me. All I got from his post is that he thinks he might need it. I don’t think he was even seen by a physician. It’s very likely that he didn’t need one at all. Or maybe he needed a different diagnostic test (? CT). I don’t know if we can have any idea.
Well the other complaint is the dual price system.
But I dunno, if you think it’s totally fine that preventative care is still prohibitively expensive for people paying thousands a year in insurance, then I guess we’re just not gonna agree on this topic.
The dual price system is a problem. I didn’t see that as the main point of your post, but I don’t disagree with that.
Doctor in Mexico recommended the ultrasound. I also thought I needed an ultrasound. It’s a fairly standard follow procedure for my symptoms.
Like I said, if your complaint is that doctors do a bunch of unnecessary tests, then I’ve got no problem with that. It’s a legitimate problem and part of the reason our costs are so high.
I’m still confused. So the doctor in Mexico recommended the ultrasound. So instead of getting it when you saw him in Mexico, you came back to the US, priced it out, and then decided to go back to Mexico for the test.
Seems like a weird sequence of events, but I guess if you live in a border town or something that would be perfectly reasonable.
Well stomach type problems are usually nothing but it’s possible it could be something serious. So following up about some benign sounding symptoms is kinda preventative, isn’t it?
No I priced it out in the US and then went to Mexico and saw a Dr and got the ultrasound here.
No. Preventative has a pretty specific meaning. It means doing shit when you have no problems or symptoms. If you actually have abdominal pain, that is most definitely not preventative.
Of course, that it is not preventative does not justify the exorbitant cost. That’s a problem. But once again, it has nothing to do with whether the recommended tests find something or not. Does the cost suddenly become justified if they find a stomach cancer? No. The cost is equally ridiculous no matter what they find or don’t find.