The College Protest Thread: Countdown to Kent State 2.0

I’ve got news for you: you’re engaging with a bad-faith interlocutor.

An artist’s role isn’t to take a fully thought through and nuanced view. It’s to rage against the machine. That song is a banger.

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Try reading, that is not what I’m advocating.

America already has crazy private property rights. Owning things like minerals, oil and gas, water and historic resources because they happen to be on your property is truly nuts. Those things should all belong to the common good. As for thickcut’s idea about property rights protecting the environment this is just backwards. Nearly all the environmental issues we face are due to externalities where effects spread past private property boundaries. The majority of environmental law is trying to deal with this issue.

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I’m sure the First Nation’s people have been overwhelmed by the generosity of that concept.

Indigenous lands are a different issue as they are treated as somewhat sovereign nations who can set their own rules.

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You are advocating for “greater respect” for private property rights, I.e., stronger private property rights, as a way to promote better “environmental outcomes.” You said that lack of respect for private property rights has led to worse environmental outcomes than lack of respect for communal property, and you pointed to government taking indigenous land for pipelines as an example. The implication of your position is that we need to restrict the government’s ability to take private property. The only way that can occur in the US is to curb the government’s ability to regulate private property.

Meh, it’s not really a different issue, though. It’s more a distinction in where you draw the line as to the area that constitutes the common good. Drawing the line at the nation level is arbitrary just as at the state or tribe, or county level. If you think the line should be drawn at the nation level, you really should support federal ownership of natural resources regardless of what type of sovereign you are dealing with. It’s too complicated an issue to be boiled down to a bright line position on all natural resources, imo.

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Google tells me the Crown owns 80% of the mineral rights. And you are loaded with oil in Canada. How come you aren’t as flush with a sovereign fund as Norway?

(Eta: you produce 2.5x as much oil, but have 6x the population and are huge geographically. It’s that enough of an explanation? You have kinda a good sovereign fund?)

We need the govt and corporations to stop teaming up to shield themselves from litigation and to give property owners, whether an individual or group, more teeth to hold corporations accountable for the negative externalities that polluting causes.

There are several neighborhoods less than 5 miles from where I grew where the people that live there are way more likely to get cancer.

To date the govt and the corporation involved has not been held accountable. It’s been a battle for over a decade at this point.

We need laws that allows communities to hold corporations accountable.

The global legal system draws the lines at the national level. It’s not really useful to contemplate that changing. It’s why climate change treaties are voluntary.

not arguing with you overall point about land ownership being crazy, and ianal, but technically all those rights are separate from your property. you need extra permits to extract resources, and sometimes even collect rainwater on your own land. land law bars others from extracting resources from your land without your permission, with eminent domain superseding and can force ownership transfer.

canadian oil is crap quality so we get less for it. More refining is needed so it’s more expensive and quality is poor so price is lower. Pipelines will help with transportation costs, but we can’t get them built.

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That doesn’t change the fact that the National-level line is arbitrary and not really any more or less crazy than other lines depending on the resource you’re considering. Look at what Brazil is doing with their forests. It’s pretty crazy to cut out the rest of the world from ownership/management of the Amazon. On the other end of the spectrum it would be insane to think that Oregon or Utah should have a say in how Florida uses its groundwater.

i don’t agree at all. “we intend to force the board of trustees to agree to a policy” is a better phrase than “i cannot comment”. the school administrators have no tools to influence government officials.

seriously doubt anyone, much less majority, gets “piss off” from reading plato. not a humanities major, and the only philosophy that was required in college was bit and pieces in history or literature classes, so it could all be different at columbia or whatever, but i think not. to claim kids are so much more media savvy is also wishful. nobody is immune to having read some bullshit somewhere. ending this tangent.

https://x.com/JHWeissmann/status/1787903193575473642

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https://twitter.com/tmorello/status/1787700561892221114?t=saDz1lyHGh-RaSPQikDIPw&s=19

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Yea but what if we rage on behalf of the machine

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Here’s the difference between Trump and Biden on protests.

https://twitter.com/dburbach/status/1787839814542234054?t=OyoRaz_hFefaLaReo2ju_Q&s=19

https://twitter.com/KnowaWasTaken/status/1786069606844485861?t=vTgCyyUaI-y1fTMlnKexzg&s=19