Yeah I definitely remember the Obama admin snatching people off the street and throwing them into unmarked vans… and he totally used federal law enforcement to break up protests. I also clearly imagined the civil rights cases they put on basically every police department that triggered riots.
Also I must have imagined all those DOJ civil rights investigations of police departments lol.
I suspect this site will be fine after Trump. The far left people are going to start unironically going after Biden with the exact same vitriol they threw at Trump the day after inauguration… which is a real problem for converting additional people and getting the popular mandate you need to get what you want done without a bunch of compromises.
I’m really glad it’s AOC who is going to lead this movement and not Bernie or people like Bernie. You people are complete idiots when it comes to getting shit done in the real world. Sorry not sorry.
Until we release them within at most a week or two until they appear for their court date in a few years yes. If your goal is to have zero detention you’re going to be waiting a while. The difference between processing them through at a reasonable pace with the goal being to move them along through the system, and intentionally jamming the process and letting them pile up in massively overcrowded concentration camps… yeah obviously there’s no gap there you guys are totally right.
This thread turned into a how to be a moron about messaging guide super super fast lol.
Yes my goal is to reform our long and immoral immigration system and no longer put kids or adults for that matter behind chainlinked fences.
The other goal is to make sure if dems win they don’t get to put their heads in the sand and ignore the horror stories which happened before trump and will happen after.
Holy shit, the Obama administration had secret police who snatched protesters off the streets into unmarked vans? I totally missed it, I must be a fucking idiot!
Another reminder that we aren’t a buncha Mad-Men gurus who are going to be brainstorming up highly paid ‘messaging’ advice to the future J.Biden administration.
We are ~50 ex-poker players chatting around our obscure virtual water cooler. Nothing we post here makes any IRL differences regarding the ‘massaging’ done by these firms or their politician customers.
There are other threads for chatting about second-order issues like ‘massaging’. SMH. It’s like somebody who thinks chatting about sportsball is all about how the industry markets the games, and what the ratings and attendance figures are.
Don’t really understand the vitriol in this post, but I saw people get arrested in unmarked vehicles, sorry it didn’t make the news or whatever. I also had friends who disappeared for days, we had no idea what happened to them.
The oversight of police departments is a legitimate point as ineffective as such oversight was and is. But yeah, Trump dropped it entirely and it’s obvious he’s giving carte blanche to do whatever they want.
If you want to pretend to be ignorant about Occupy, Ferguson, Baltimore, Standing Rock, and the entire history of the United States–which I know you’re not–to ignore the fact that Trump’s treatment of protestors, or shall we say the treatment of protestors by the civil police forces of the United States, is merely a continuation of how it has always been and how it was under Obama, okay. But don’t try to pretend taking issue with you is equating Obama and Trump on everything or whatever. Because the reality is every single time someone disagrees with you guys on a point here, you get so defensive and dismissive. And normally this isn’t you specifically, but here it is.
I would have expected it from Cuse. He delivered in the end.
Oh hey guys look that law about 10 year penalties that Trump has been banging on about because Trump is so much worse on protestors!
Obama said really nice things though about the right to protest, then allowed his network of goons to beat the shit out of people in the street. Which to the liberal is a step up from celebrating having your goons beat people up.
Yes I’m aware that law enforcement, including federal law enforcement (although I see zero mention of said Federal law enforcement doing anything but gathering intel and passing it to the cops at worst… and that doesn’t actually require any input from the WH to happen as fucked up as our system is) has been heavily coopted by corporate interests.
Nothing in this article describes anything close to what is happening under Trump lol. You’re literally playing the both sides argument here, and not well.
Nobody is saying Obama was perfect, but claiming that Biden won’t be an absolutely massive positive change on this vs Trump is just laugh out loud stupid. Occupy Wall Street was a large two month long sit in as close as physically possible to the financial capital of the fucking world. The feds watched it carefully and Obama made vaguely sympathetic noises. Eventually the NYPD forced them out. Please compare that to the response to George Floyd protests where the cops and feds were actively cooperating with white supremacist groups and the POTUS was fantasizing about machine gunning protesters with the fucking army every day.
This is one of my core problems with hard leftists… You guys are not good at recognizing the difference between bad and much fucking worse and often enable the latter in your pursuit of the perfect. It’s just not a workable political strategy and I wish you guys would wise the fuck up since I share a ton of your objectives.
Not a chance. AOC will go after Biden when it’s good for achieving her political objectives. A lot of leftists aren’t aware of just how gifted a political talent AOC is it seems. She’s going to play her hand extremely well and get a lot done in real life while eschewing just scoring rhetorical points on Twitter…
She’ll be critical when she wants to apply the stick and say nice things about people she has a lot of disagreements with when she wants a carrot. This isn’t a bad thing.
Politics is a game whether we like it or not. It doesn’t matter if you find the game morally repugnant, that game is how political power gets distributed everywhere in the world… and AOC isn’t just a player on the field she’s a star player on the field.
What part of this discussion is not furthering the end you want? It’s just some imaginary nonsense in your head. Almost all of the monolithic “hard leftists” are voting for Biden. Almost all of the “hard leftists” support incremental improvement. Almost all of the “hard leftists” have Obama’s response to protest etched on their bodies.
You have so much emotionally invested in the last paragraph that you can’t see how my response had absolutely nothing to do with any of that nor does it do any of the harm you are imagining.
@ggoreo I think was the person who introduced this forum to AOC or it was another leftist poster, what you mean is “Thanks leftist for introducing AOC to us centrists who believe she’s one of us, because her political brain is awesome”
As far as I can see, it’s the centrists here like you, Clovis and others who constantly swear at us far left folks, tell us how dumb and wrong we are on a weekly basis and then complain like the right wing assholes that you are.
I’m from the UK… Ain’t nothing left about you lot that’s for sure, BTW get fucked.
Dude… you’re busy claiming that Obama wasn’t much better than Trump on civil rights. Literally smearing the first black president as similar to the far right temper tantrum to his very blackness. It’s really gross.
I think Bernie has been close to worthless as a politician and hasn’t accomplished a single thing of real note legislatively in his entire career… which has been going for quite some time.
Ranting in the wilderness isn’t driving progress. The times caught up to Bernie, Bernie didn’t actually do anything at all to bring them about. Making HRC look bad in a primary is not that big of an accomplishment. If he was a good candidate he’d have beaten her like Obama did and then beaten Trump… and we wouldn’t be here. Instead he lost and here we are. Just like he always does. Losing with honor is a specialty of the American left and I’m sick of it.
It’s long past time for the left to get a hell of a lot more pragmatic. I’m grateful to say that I’m seeing some things that give me a lot of hope that we’ll be getting that going forward.
Attacking Biden on civil rights before he’s even been sworn in is a great example of how you alienate the obvious majority of the Democratic party and ensure that you don’t even get to be in the room when they are figuring out what to do next. That doesn’t serve the cause except to give you a righteousness high. We can’t afford it at this point so stop.
I can’t wait tbh