It makes what you’re saying pointless. The question isn’t “Are people consuming more energy than they’re expending on a global pandemic level?” We already know the answer to that. The question is why are they doing that and how do we correct it? That’s the point where CICO people stop giving correct answers.
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The answer is the same regardless of the reason: They need to eat fewer calories than they burn. Boom.
Definitely not pointless. For example in that case of the fitness model, if you’re trying to figure out what’s going on, you can consider calories in, but if that doesn’t seem to explain it, then you can look for things that are fucking up calories expended.
Maybe if that doc had a better grasp of CICO that woman would have been diagnosed earlier. Don’t blame thermodynamics for him being bad at his job.
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What?? Like in your model, anything which could cause weight gain or loss is definitionally a part of “CICO”. “Something is causing this woman to gain weight” and “Something related to CICO is causing this woman to gain weight” are identical statements to you, the latter is just a tautology. It doesn’t narrow it down or give a place to start in the slightest.
Which do you think is a more accurate statement?
- The women Lawnmower_Man posted are gaining weight because of a metabolic dysfunction.
- The women Lawnmower_Man posted are gaining weight because they are ingesting more calories than they expend.
The latter is incredibly misleading at best. For starters, it provides no explanation of why the women are putting on FAT and not lean weight. It also frames their weight gain as being their fault rather than the consequence of a disease.
What Victor is saying here is that weight loss is a simple equation for most of the population and people just fuck it up. I actually still have no idea whether you also believe this or not because your posts are contradictory, but anyway, “weight loss is CICO” is shorthand for this view, it’s not shorthand for “I believe in the First Law of Thermodynamics”. You are being way too literal and technical with your interpretation of what it means to say this. It’s like those guys who say “well All Lives do Matter, what’s wrong with saying that?”. It’s missing the point.
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I didn’t say anything about counting calories. And also, your solution seems to have broken down a few times as well just by the fact that you mentioned “in all phases of my life when I was overweight.”
Every solution typically breaks down for people who have trouble controlling their weight. But I’ve also had long stretches of being very fit, so I would not say that my particular way of going about doing things is necessarily wrong for me. It’s worked very well at times.
But I agree that addressing other issues would likely help a person maintain compliance with whatever strategy they use.
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I don’t know how people in hot countries avoid putting on lots of weight.
It’s been mid 30s here for a few days and I can already feel the pounds going on through lack of exercise.
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Telling overweight people CICO is the solution is the same as telling people in poverty the solution is to make more money.
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The fat poor people should stop buying food its a win-win.
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Global warming is also simple: the amount of heat coming in is greater than the amount of heat going out. Nobel Prize me.
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But it absolutely does explain everything according to CICO–she’s simply overeating! If there’s any gain in weight, then by definition, it’s always caused by overeating. No further work required.
You have to be trolling at this point.
Do you agree that, with the exception of the rare medical condition, the answer to losing weight is to eat fewer calories than you burn?
And that for the most part the differences in people’s metabolism (when controlled for age, sex, height, exercise, and weight) are actually fairly insignificant?
There are no fat people that eat like a bird and no skinny people that eat whatever they want (unless they exercise for hours). Despite a ton of people that would argue otherwise. I’m fat because I eat too much - just like the vast majority of the rest of the fatties out there.
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No. I don’t think there are any exceptions. If you have positive energy balance you’ll gain weight (non-water mass) of some type. We’re talking about obesity from fat though, right? So I’m also concerned about body comp.
False.
False.
Differences in metabolism when controlled for other variables amounts to something like 50 calories per day at most according to Lyle McDonald. There is no voodoo magic going on with people unless they have a medical condition.
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Is that this guy?
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Indeed. And I misremembered, the difference wasn’t a max of 50 calories a day but 150 calories a day. Still basically a small enough number that it shouldn’t matter.
If it’s not a big deal then overeating by 150 calories per day shouldn’t matter. Also, I’m not gonna take some unhinged fitness blog bro’s word for it so we’re gonna need to pull some studies on this.
I know. It’s amazing how thermodynamics always works. Who could have possibly imagined that?
I don’t know why you’re so surprised. This was already explained before. It appears that, in this case (fitness model), her tumor lead to a change in body composition causing her to increase fat and decrease muscle. Muscle is more metabolically active than fat and burns more calories (i.e., more calories out). Fat burns fewer calories. Because of her changed body composition she was burning fewer calories, so even though she was eating less she gained weight. There were likely other factors at work as well.
They are both true.
I didn’t get the memo on these rules. Comparing CICO to BLM is megaLOL. As I said from the very beginning, I can’t speak for everyone who says CICO, I can only tell you what I’m saying. And what I’m saying is what it literally means.
I’d probably agree with that. I guess it depends on exactly what you mean by “fuck it up”. To be clear, “most” means more than half. I don’t know what the number is, but I’m certain it’s more than half.
It’s not a big deal in the sense that there is nobody eating like a bird (i.e. - way below what a BMR calculator would predict as their break even point) yet gaining a ton of weight. And there are no skinny guys who eat every day like they’re Bobby Muffins (RIP) on a bender. Plus or minus 150 calories just doesn’t account for those kind of discrepancies.
Now I think the problem is you don’t understand CICO.
I’d say it’s always caused by relative overeating. But lets say that we did some very accurate logging and observation and determined that she maintains a constant weight at an intake of 900kcal per day. That is highly atypical for a woman of her age, size, and activity. So it would require someone who is not an idiot to investigate why her calories out are so low.
I don’t know why you think I’m trolling. If someone has firm grasp of this basic thermodynamic principles and biology, then these things logically follow.
Maybe we have a different meaning of “shouldn’t matter”, but 150 calories per day works out to 15 pounds over the course of a year, which seems pretty significant to me.
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