I can’t imagine spending more than $50 on a scale, the Hario V60 seems like it does everything you could possibly need. I have a cheapo kitchen scale that I’m using now, and the biggest problem for me is that it has a 1 gram resolution, and even that isn’t a big enough deal to push me to spend $50 for the Hario.
1 Like
It’s entirely possible I’m misremembering the 175 number. We currently pour from this: VE Hybrid Water Boiler & Warmer CV-DCC40/50 | Zojirushi.com, so the temperature should be pretty consistent. I suppose that leaves us with primary options of 195 and 208 based on the presets. Pouring through Chemex filters on a Bodum (Chemex clone) pour-over system. Grinding with a $60 Cuisinart burr grinder with a URL so long that I’ll save you all from posting it.
I’d be happy to upgrade anything that’s worth upgrading. I assume the grinder is the likely weak spot in our system.
Thanks for the help getting more informed about a growing interest.
1 Like
Yeah I’m with you. I went cold on the Hario after researching it though. Seems to be fragile, and the dope version with stainless plate and backlit negative display costs nearly twice as much.
The rugged, no-frills option that’s popular with coffee enthusiasts is the Jennings (now JScale) CJ4000. It has 4 kg max capacity, auto-off disable feature, stainless plate, ability to run on AC or AAA batteries, backlight, but unfortunately only 0.5 g resolution. It’s under $30 and has 2-year warranty. They have some other models with lower (600 g, 1 kg) max load capacity and 0.1 g resolution that might be similarly priced.
So the Bodum just sits under the Zoji and you press the button to dispense water? Regardless, the 208 F (98 C) is your only option. I would not be surprised if the water reads exactly 205 F (96 C) at the point it contacts the grounds.
The grinder is probably the weakest link but I’m not sure you’d see enough jump in quality in the next tier of grinders (Baratza Encore ~$130, Lido ~$180) to justify the cost. There are always things you can improve within your current setup that you may not be aware of. For instance, if you aren’t using only bleached Chemex filters and rinsing them thoroughly, that’s a leak. Are you agitating the bed during the bloom and after the pour properly? Etc.
And like I’ve said before, I’m not entirely convinced that grinding at home is the best option for most people; it may be having the shop grind EK43 for you and then stashing it in single-serve vacuum packs in your freezer.
You could be thinking of tea. I bought my tea-drinking in-law one of those Stagg EKG kettles a few years ago with a sampler pack of loose teas. My parents were asking if I wrapped the wrong gift. I felt like the dude in the American Chopper meme:
Alternate ending for ROW:
“I ONLY BREW AT ONE TEMPERATURE: 205 F OR 96 CENTIGRADE.”
“THAT’S TWO TEMPERATURES.”
2 Likes
First up is the Mikava CM Gesha (green bag) from Colombia. Weird intro to my first gesha yesterday as I was distracted by things I had to take: phone during the bloom and door after drawdown. Auto-off feature reared its ugly head but I knew my bloom weight and recovered. Was a little distracted and not overly focused on coffee.
Waiting on V60 paper so this is Chemex only right now. Both are natural process i.e., good match. Bleached filters, default Chemex grind (24), and recipe water at 205+. Ground fragrance was sharp and overpowering but not particularly pleasant. Beans were a medium matte brown and uniform in color. These bloomed up to a fluffy marshmellow texture which I held until 0:45. Drawdown was pretty quick for Chemex at 3:50 which had me wondering if this was perhaps too coarse.
I’ve been thinking about glass design a lot lately and went with a China tea cup for this given the gesha’s reputation. I usually drink coffee by pouring small amounts (1-2 oz at a time) into my favorite mug–a small (gasp) STARBUCKS ceramic–and sipping. I figured out why and will write about it later.
Nosing didn’t reveal much. The first hit did, however. Initial taste was startling and I struggled to process it. I don’t remember any actual notes, just “whoa that’s different and good.” It opens incredibly similar to (black?) tea but with some added alcoholic bite/spiciness that I get in the roof of the mouth and nose. Then it shifts smoothly into juicy lemon acidity that was round and sweet, not tart, and with some spice. The finish was chalky and medicinal like chewing Tylenol. So I have this coffee doing 2/3 tricks but doing them incredibly well. The contrast between the open and the body and the quality of both is why it’s $28/lb. It’s actually pretty close to the Elida, but I’d say this one is more distinctly unusual. There is this quality both have which is like the sweet bite of a good whiskey that I can still taste and smell hours later.
Day 2: I changed two things today. I used filtered water and went back to my mug. Now here is the interesting part: the distinct tea-like open was missing and the spicy lemon acidity was amplified, maybe a bit more sour. Finish was better and not Tylenol, just barely chalky. All signs point to lower extraction, but why? That sets up a nice little 2x2 ANOVA for tomorrow morning to figure out what’s going on here. I’ll be shocked if it’s the glassware and intrigued if it’s the water. Could be neither.
1 Like
Yeah. Thanks for your tips elsewhere! Our Gesha just came in today. Will give it the best shot we can given our setup.
1 Like
I’ve been secretly hoping that your technique involves moving the brewer in concentric circles under the stream to emulate a hand pour. And secretly, secretly hoping that it’s a machine you invented that does this, not your hand.
Oh, I absolutely rotate the Bodum to emulate actual pour-over technique. I thought your question was just about whether the water sits in another vessel before it hits the coffee.
1 Like
FWIW I have several starbucks cups and they are all really great. The double-walled ceramic cup that looks sort of like their standard paper cup is my favorite, but I’ve broken like four of them (I really prefer ceramic cups and I used to take these with me everywhere until I got sick of buying new ones).
Their steel vacuum tumblers are also very good. Most of them are very easy to clean (the lids don’t have a lot of tiny nooks and crannies etc). They’ve had steel cups the last few years for their January refill tumbler (they used to use plastic for these) and they’re a great deal. $40 and you get a tumbler that would normally cost $25 alone and free brewed coffee/tea for the whole month of january (I get their tea).
1 Like
We’ve now tried both Geshas, though we ran out of Chemex filters immediately prior and have been slumming it with generic paper until a new set of the former arrives. As-is, both are fantastic, distinct beans with uniquely citrus tea-like profiles. The CM Gesha had a pronounced, lingering aftertaste that I would describe (with limited coffee expertise) as oak-aged, smoked lemons. The Natural was fairly consistent with the bag description - noticeably floral and with an acidic profile more like pomegranate and (to me) raspberry than citrus.
A cool experience to share in, and one we’ll look forward to further exploring. Thanks for the recommendation.
1 Like
After that great first brew of the CM, had a couple disappointing days with borderline sour brews. I haven’t tried the Gesha village yet because I actually received another gesha and decided to hit it right away.
I’ve played around with water (recipe, filtered, tap), grind settings, temps, cups. Still couldn’t repeat the tea-forward profile from the CM and noticed that my blooms were setting up sort of strange. Both of these coffees seem to soak up water and get fluffy, and I had recently started backing off the volume of bloom water from a liberal 3x+ to a more conservative 2x - 2.5x of the grinds weight. I’m fairly positive it was channeling, giving me fast brew times and low extraction.
Today I overpoured to almost 4x (120g water for 30g coffee) on the Zapote and used an aggressive swirl to saturate the grinds evenly. I actually like this technique better than using the spoon to stir. I think it’s more consistent, almost like centrifuging, versus using the spoon to stir. I learned in this vid from Hoffman (former barista champion):
It seemed to set up better today drawing at 3:55. It tasted slightly over-x probably due to the grind size change, definitely not sour or under-x. The coffee itself wasn’t that remarkable but I’ll try again tomorrow.
1 Like
Thing I realized is the one I kept going back to was the closest thing I have to a nosing glass for whiskey. It has a better flare at the lip and narrower chamber than anything else I own. MS Paint incoming:
I think the problem with double-walled anything is that the individual walls are thin and therefore fragile. They can also be too thick at the rim. Everyone says that about the glass ones. Then Kruve was like “we’ve got your practical solution right here.”
Will be interesting to see if you lose any of the profile going to genuine thick Chemex paper. Always get the bleached Chemex btw. Tasters repeatedly complain that the difference between un/bleached in Chemex specifically is huge. I have new V60 papers coming tomorrow and they certainly let more through.
Curious: who here still uses a moka pot?
I love hoffman’s yt channel and i dunno shit about coffee.
1 Like
World champion barista or whatever tastes every instant coffee in the supermarket
Those reaction faces are amazing. Starting to realize he sounds like Winnie the Pooh.
Well this thread has sent me down a semi-scientific rabbit hole of coffee-experimentation and speculation so I’ll try and keep things reasonably-updated.
For my taste, I do think these geshas benefit from retaining some of the acids/oils. The Chemex version was probably my least favorite, with standard paper and even a metal filter both retaining more of the fruit flavors that I tend to enjoy. That said, my n=1 with each technique, so I’m not cold on my conclusions yet.
Weirdly, one of my favorite coffee experiences of all time remains a cold-brew of this: https://www.caffeic.coffee/collections/bulk-coffees/products/sun-dried-ethiopia-bulk, which seemed to actually accentuate the blueberry flavors vs. traditional brewing. I assume that’s because the fruit flavors - in this bean - are not acid-derived, but I say this as someone who is at the .05/.10 nl level of the coffee connoisseur progression.
EDIT: I SCREWED UP AN APOSTROPHE, DANGIT.
1 Like
The rabbit hole is deep.
This gesha from Boston is pretty underwhelming for the most expensive coffee I’ve had. Tried one of the last tricks I know today by ghetto sieving out the fines using the paper towel method. That surprisingly improved this coffee–cleaner and more delicate. The middle tasting notes of pineapple and pink lemonade were more believable. Still couldn’t get the jasmine aroma or open that they claim. I can grind a little finer tomorrow since it was so clean. It’s very good coffee, but not better than some of the $15/lb ones I’ve had.