Fyp
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0==0
You mean like this?
I’ve been to Siberia. When you get behind any big truck it’s like being behind some idiot in the US rolling coal.
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Meanwhile, for those not stuck in the 1950s, or wherever the brains of the liberals dwell, we got shit like this…
Inb4 the (capitalist) Turkish and the (capitalist) Russians violently crushed Rojava, while the (capitalist) US abandoned their former allies.
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THE LIBERALS!
Tell me about it… the liberals are still fighting the cold war 30 years after the fall of the Berlin Wall. They’re like those Japanese soldiers who kept on fighting WW2 for decades after it ended.
“Surely, my liberal friends, you do not want Cold War Communism back?” Once again this argument was unanswerable. Certainly the liberals did not want Cold War Communism back; if the holding of debates regarding the unsustainability of capitalism was liable to bring Cold War Communism back, then debate must stop. Clovis8, who had now had time to think things over, voiced the general feeling of the liberals by saying: “If the Donkeys say it, it must be right.” And from then on he adopted the maxim, “The Donkey is always right,” in addition to his private motto of "I will work harder.”
(sorry George)
This article was published by the Foundation for Economic Freedom(FEE). Generally, when an organization has “freedom” and “economic” in its name it’s a right-wing, capitalism is awesome(!) group pumping out propaganda–which in this case includes climate change denial-ism.
From FEE’s wikipedia page: Since 1946 FEE has also sponsored public lectures by various thinkers, including Ludwig von Mises,[36] F.A. Hayek,[37] Henry Hazlitt,[38] Milton Friedman,[39] James M. Buchanan,[40] Vernon Smith,[41] Walter Williams,[42] F.A. “Baldy” Harper,[43] and William F. Buckley Jr.[44]
During his extended graduate studies at Columbia University, Murray Rothbard was influenced by FEE economist Baldy Harper.[28] Rothbard credited FEE with creating a “crucial open center” for a libertarian movement.[29] Friedrich Hayek saw FEE as part of the inspiration for the formation of the Mont Pelerin Society in 1947.[30] Beyond inspiration, FEE provided a financial subsidy to the Mont Pelerin Society.[31] Hayek encouraged Antony Fisher to found the Institute of Economic Affairs after visiting FEE in 1952. [32] Ludwig von Mises had a “long-term association with the Foundation for Economic Education.”[33]
FYI, in case you don’t recognize the names, Hayek, Rothbard, and von Mises are like the 3 favorite sources for libertarians and ACers.
Here is what Greenpeace has to say about FEE:
https://www.greenpeace.org/usa/global-warming/climate-deniers/front-groups/foundation-for-economic-education-fee/
Greenpeace classifies the FEE as a “Koch Industries Climate Denial Front Group”, saying: “Unscientific skepticism and obstructionism regarding global warming are promoted both on FEE’s blogs and through The Freeman –including Willie Soon, whose grants since 2002 are exclusively from fossil fuel interests, and the promotion of two books by discredited industry apologist scientists Patrick Michaels and Robert Balling.”
DeSmog compiled some FEE climate change quotes:
“Cost-benefit analysis (CBA) implies we should do very little to prevent climate change. Instead, we should create wealth. Expanding the productive capacity of the economy will compensate future generations better than reductions in GHG will. A richer world in 2100, after all, will be able to afford to do things like relocating people affected by rising sea levels and constructing new port facilities and seawalls.”
“CO2 generally provides great benefits for the earth and mankind, […] These benefits are in addition to those that are likely to occur in the event that warming actually takes place. Increased temperatures, especially those that occur overnight, will delay the first frost and prolong growing seasons, further expanding crop yields.”
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Bottom up community control isn’t immune from stupid/corrupt peeps either. The difference is that some hereditary subset of the stupid/corrupt wouldn’t be at the peek of a violent hierarchy. The difference is that some hereditary subset of the stupid/corrupt wouldn’t be absentee owners.
This doesn’t have anything directly to do with worker control of the means of production (aka ‘socialism’). The issue is this: capitalism is fundamentally in opposition to bottom up community control.
So we’re just attacking the source now w/o reading the article - like chiefsplanet does with CNN?
The article is basically just lifting from this:
https://psmag.com/social-justice/the-senseless-environment-crime-of-the-20th-century-russia-whaling-67774
Wikipedia work for you?
What is your overall thesis here - that the Soviet Union gets a bad rap? Is that what all this is about - you guys are tankies like Einbert? Is your goal to ruin every thread on this site with this shit?
Looking forward to anything but a straight answer.
What’s your overall thesis here yourself. What are you trying to prove by posting shit the USSR did decades ago?
Are you going to ruin every thread with this ancient USSR crap?
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The Soviets caught a lot of whales in the 50s through the 80s but they are a distant second place behind Norway in whaling and Japan is a close third.
Not to say that the Soviets weren’t terrible, but if someone is trying to paint that as uniquely evil, then that is just their agenda showing.
Hey suzzer. I feel you’ve extrapolated a bit and ended up somewhere I wasn’t intending with my post. I understand how you could take my post as me knee jerk defending the USSR and/or attacking a source rather than the article that you posted. Communication is a two way street, so part or all of that’s on me.
I made that post in response to you because: If I shared a link in the Climate Change and Environment thread from an organization known to actively participate in climate change denial-ism, I’d hope if someone else knew that, that they’d point it out to me.
I knew who FEE are, so I shared that with you. You were on their website, I’m looking out for you.
I am not Chiefs plant material, or a communist, or a Soviet Union apologist, or a tankie. Those all sound like insults. I’m willing to agree to not insult each other any more.
That’s a straight answer.
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Nobody is saying the USSR didn’t suck.
I’m still waiting for somebody to explain what the USSR, which collapsed decades ago, has to do with combatting environmental collapse today?
Ok I will keep giving you the benefit of the doubt then. FEE was just the first result I came up with for this thread. I read the story elsewhere a while back.
It was the part about them not even needing the whales and just doing it to please the bureaucracy that really got me.
I never read it as “Soviet Union is worse than capitalism!”. Soviet Union sucks. Civilization sucks. People suck. The US is founded on slavery and genocidal lies and continues to be a racist shithole to this day.
Well, if you weren’t trying to make a point, and just tsk-tsk-ing on some evil crap that happened in the past, that’s a different story. Here’s another one…
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I’m a little skeptical though of the asides in that article about how Norway and Japan used every part of the whales. It would not be shocking to see similar things where they left lots of the whales to rot.
People talk about regulations though like they are just things that are easy to make happen. They only happen when most people care about stuff like this. That’s exactly the same barrier that is involved if you are talking about consumer choices. But, at least if 49% of consumers decide to care they can make a 49% difference. If only 49% of the people care about getting some regulations, those regulations will not happen.
I know that’s not exactly true, and that minority interests can get regulations, but that usually works against the environment.
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Well yeah apparently FEE is some Koch brothers rag. But this article isn’t saying Norway used every piece like the plains Indians with the buffalo:
https://psmag.com/social-justice/the-senseless-environment-crime-of-the-20th-century-russia-whaling-67774
Unlike Norway and Japan, the other major whaling nations of the era, the Soviet Union had little real demand for whale products. Once the blubber was cut away for conversion into oil, the rest of the animal, as often as not, was left in the sea to rot or was thrown into a furnace and reduced to bone meal—a low-value material used for agricultural fertilizer, made from the few animal byproducts that slaughterhouses and fish canneries can’t put to more profitable use. “It was a good product,” Dmitri Tormosov, a scientist who worked on the Soviet fleets, wryly recalls, “but maybe not so important as to support a whole whaling industry.”
I know Japan eats whales. Assuming Norway does too?
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