Or more realistically, read this thread:
I don’t think you understand what the word “profit” means. Or “owned”.
Wow, you (um, we) really like to argue. This is one of those topics that only gets more contentious the more people talk about it. There is no viable compromise when it comes to getting ads especially if the discussion on how admin should be compensated for past/present/future is folded in at the same time.
Seems like the best thing is just to go with something like Micro proposed above. I would remove the opt-out language and make TL3 be the criterion for ads-free. (Of course, there needs to be some way to provide feedback (complain) about the specific ads that are shown, but I think this is already happening.)
If and when the site ever gets big enough to generate big bucks, we’ll undoubtedly have subsequent discussions (and the site and maybe the admin will likely be much different than it is today).
My advice is to declare victory and move on!
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This site lists the median at 61k which is in the neighborhood of $27/hr. Does this seem reasonable? Would expect there are others who could offer an opinion on how fair this is as well.
Can’t really do this without an estimate for your hours tho if you’re to collect what you feel you’re owed. And so everyone has a better understanding of what the site is earning and spending.
you’re making the decision to show us all ads so you can pay yourself an unlimited amount of money. to me it’s embezzlement from the community but i thought “you owning a for-profit business” was a more generous interpretation because i didn’t want to come off as too mean.
when that suspicious vote occurred which you claim gives you carte blanche wrt our community, it was NOT clear that we were voting for zikzak to be the next mason malmuth and we’re all going to be force marched onto his site where he calls the shots. the section about ads was in case not enough people donated to fund the necessary costs to keep the lights on. the idea that you can now submit a padded resume to yourself and demand uncapped remuneration is corruption. if you don’t feel like working on this site for 2 hours this week then just don’t work 2 hours this week and we’ll see what happens.
That’s for a salaried employee. Freelance is much higher. Gotta cover my overhead.
Seriously tho, what the heck is your goal here? Any number I give you that is based on the real world is going to end up being thousands and thousand of dollars more than the site can ever pay. Do you want the forum to have huge bills it can’t afford? Do you not believe me? Do you think this place is actually a secret gold mine that I’m going to plunder by taking the money that I don’t even have access to?
The site doesn’t make enough money to pay a fair wage to anybody. It almost certainly never will. What is so difficult about this for you to understand?
Those sound like pretty serious accusations. You should probably petition for my removal and ask everybody to go back to Exiled.
What the hell is going on in this thread
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Yeah it’s weird going back to exile comes up in a discussion about ads are ads are absolutely on for everyone there and with no control or input from anyone.
trump has 50% approval. human beings don’t care about corruption or mismanagement if they like the guy personally. and you’re a really likable guy, i like you. so i think most people are comfortable enough to not care that you’re stealing from us. plus i don’t want to make a poll because the bullying behavior by yourself and your toadies would make people fear retribution for voting against you and then having to live under your vengeful and unhinged management of a community that we all value. it wouldn’t be a fair poll, your stalinist brand of politics has made sure of that.
plus like, even if a poll were to formally impeach you, you would just refuse to leave and keep paying yourself checks, there’s no actual process to stop you. you took control of all the levers of oversight during the coup.
we could end all recurring donations now and be ad free on proboards for the next 10 years. but i’m getting the impression that if we tried, zikzak would attempt to claw back those donations to pay himself for thousands of hours of “work” checking an email account and clicking “yes” on the “do you want to enable ads?” button
Fuck off with this bad faith bullshit. This conversation is never going to go anywhere if this is how you’re going to approach it.
Lots of businesses operate at a deficit to start. What they don’t tend to do is commit to a single contractor for an apparently unlimited amount. The system you seem bent on creating here is an endless revenue stream for yourself. That the site doesn’t generate what you think you’re worth hardly seems relevant since you’re taking it “all” after expenses. It would be good to know when then community could start spending revenue on things besides your, as of yet, undefined salary.
And only since you asked, what I want is to know how much you think the community owes you and what amount will keep happy moving forward. An actual number so the community can see what we’re dealing with. Otherwise just don’t say anything about the work you’ve put in, don’t take a dime, and instead bask in our appreciation and the glory of creating something wonderful. But that’s just me. Because you asked.
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The community isn’t committed to me at all. Find a replacement and we can begin the transition process.
Bit of advice: It will probably be easier to attract somebody else to fill the role if you don’t keep going out of your way to make the job an absolutely miserable experience.
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Quick update on the actual dollar amounts we’re looking at in case ya’ll ever want to ground this conversation in reality.
So, amending the stuff I posted earlier a bit…
Does anyone object to having ads be opt-out automatically at T3 (in case you missed that, you get there if you are active enough), people who want to but aren’t T3 can be made T3 if they want, and people who meet the T3 limits but want to see ads can opt-in?
I will say, that doesn’t quite make sense to me, but it’s close enough and from the discussion so far I think there shouldn’t be strong objections from anyone to that. I think it’s close enough and it matters so little that if you’re willing to accept that it would do a lot of good if you’d just say “good enough” or better yet, like this post and boost up my likes.
For now, I would just suggest people view ads if they want to support the site like that, but later I might nag a little more if someone does something cool like try to find cool businesses to advertise.
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Because it exists on every other god damn website on the internet and isn’t anywhere near the burden some of you are making it out to be.
Because it makes me feel better about doing my job knowing that the community will let me collect the few nickles I can, to share with others who have also done work.
Because it’s in the terms of the agreement my dozens of contributed hours were based on.
Look, serious talk here. Some of the arguments ITT have been kinda fun and amusing. Most of it has been aggravating, but I’ve had a couple laughs too. A tiny portion has actually been useful.
But let me be very clear that a community decision that we can’t run advertising means I will resign. And I will also be very pissed. I will try to not be a huge dick about it and will try to make the transition smooth if ya’ll can find some other sucker willing to do what I do. But if you can’t, I’m just going to flick the switch and walk away.
I believe my conditions have been incredibly reasonable and very fair to the community. I think I have showed incredible patience with all this bullshit. I’m still here trying to provide a good forum for the 290+ people who aren’t hellbent on making this whole thing a fucking burden that I loathe. But if a tiny minority of you insist on blowing the whole thing up, have at it. I won’t put up a fight.
Please, everyone, we’re really close here. We can get through this and it’s a very minor change from what’s been happening. We can rest for a while and govern more later. Please.
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TL3 auto doesn’t see ads. Make a separate group that doesn’t see ads that people who don’t meet TL3 but opt-out can be added to. Make another group that does see ads that opt-in people who meet TL3 can be added to.
?