You must either be joking or you enjoy parading your ignorance after inserting yourself into a thread. Do you know how much some of these cops make? Even IF their salaries were comparable to the working stiffs they murder and arrest, their authoritarian tyranny over them makes them elite. They’re ability to break (and often not even be subject) to the law makes them elite. What happened to the cop that murdered Breonna Taylor? Oh, right. He lost his job. And that was only after tremendous public outcry. Thinking cops are just like normal working stiffs and not elite, is just fucking comically ignorant bro and you should duck out of conversations about cops while you’re pathetically behind
Who do you think they pay off?
Here’s a hint:
No. I meant exactly what I said. The entire system is corrupt and rigged and having everyone fighting with each other over identity politics, instead of forcing them out of power is just the way “the elites” want it
What I’m trying to tease out of you is who you feel is in charge of this “elite”, and who is just along for the ride.
For example: The ultra wealthy landlords want evictions to be cheap and easy. They pay $$$ to get their politicians in office to keep things that way… because that’s what they “want”. Sure, these capitalist politicians agree that evictions should be cheap and easy also… so you could say that’s what they “want” too. But rank-n-file cops on the eviction squad… they just “want” to keep being cops.
So, the ultra-wealthy, their politicians, and the rank-n-file cops all “want” the same thing. But… evictions aren’t cheap and easy because a buncha random rank-n-file cops organized, and dragged the ultra rich and a buncha random politicians along with them. And… evictions aren’t cheap and easy because a buncha random politicians organized, and dragged the ultra wealthy and the rank-n-file cops along with them.
Instead, these politicians and cops (and court reporters, and the military, and etc/etc) are minions. So, let’s see if this makes sense to you…
The ultra wealthy (who act through their “elite” minions) use a conquer and divide strategy purporting identity politics (with the left obliging) will be the ultimate ruination of democracy.
I don’t think the typical slumlords responsible for the most egregious evictions are ultra wealthy. Or even modestly wealthy. They’re maybe upper middle class.
And a lot of “tough on crime” policies WERE implemented because the police are well organized, many people respect law enforcement, and politicians want/think they need their endorsement.
I know you support unions and other forms of collective action, but the strength of police unions and the shared identity that many police feel has absolutely impeded progress on police reform / abolition. And very little if any of that identity was formed while the officers were sitting around reminiscing about carrying out an eviction.
Landlords were just an example. I could have used ultra wealthy ‘industrialists’ who “want” cheap & easy strike suppression. Also nobody mentioned anything about “slumlord” or “egregious”.
What you bring up, in general, is the petite-bourgeoisie. Sure, your mom & pop landlord or ‘industrialist’ is going to “want” cheap & easy evictions and strike suppression. But… we don’t currently have those things because a buncha petite-bourgeoisie organized, and dragged along the ultra wealthy, a buncha politicians, and the rank-n-file cops with them.
Are they though? I imagine the properties owned by REIT’s tend to be class A and B, maybe some C mixed in. The eviction horror stories happen at the very bottom end of the market. I base that in part on this book (which I just linked to a few days ago in another thread too), another part from personal experience renting those sorts of properties, and also from personally knowing some slumlords.
Could be. I had thought more that that was true, but @Sabo had talked about how REITs bought up a lot of residential rental property (Maybe post 2008).
Sure. That may be better phrasing than what I used. But I think my point still stands. People who should be on the same side/team fighting against the “ruling class” (I’ll drop the term “elite”) are instead, being divided to fight among themselves and the left is complicit in obliging this tactic imo
This is a necessary condition for any hierarchical regime, and it’s been that way ever since the Neolithic Revolutions. People have been divided by race, religion, origin, language, diet, costumes, dress… anything that works. Always, everywhere, people have been divided by gender. Obviously I agree with this part.
So… we’re back to “the left”. I don’t self identify as a liberal, and I’m quite certain you don’t actually mean “people like me”. So… when you are referencing “the left” here, what subset of people are you referring to? Donkeys? Anti-capitalists? Peeps who write with their left hand? Some combination y/o other subset of people altogether?
I believe you (judging by the couple of responses to me calling you a liberal). This forum isn’t my home. I don’t really take the time to get know anyone specifically. I mainly respond only to the context of a post, not the individual. When you appeared to defend the left, I assumed you were a liberal (my bad)
When I call out “the left”, I am usually referencing self identified liberal sheeple who are easily herded into espousing mainstream liberal talking points because they are either too lazy, or simply unable to dissect, parse, and think through an issue independently
OK VG. It’s a pet peeve of mine, but I really wish folks here would just stop non-ironically using the term “the left”.
Notice that your usage has nothing to do with any ideology.
Anyone can self-identify as a liberal, regardless of their ideology. Anyone can be a sheeple. Conversely, any plausible position, including those infamous “liberal talking points”, can be arrived at in a non-sheeple manner. Likewise, anyone can self-identify as a conservative, again regardless of their ideology, and they can be just as big sheeple as anyone else.
However, have you considered this complete untethering of ideology from the term “the left” seems to bring up some conundrums…
Why call out “the left” when “the right” can be just as big of sheeple? Why not just call out sheeple in general? Isn’t this kinda like if some baseball fan was saying: “those damn left handed pitchers trash the bullpen”… but if somebody asks about the right handed pitchers, that fan says “yeah, they’re just as bad”. WTF does being “the left” in particular have to do with things here?
OK, let’s say for conversation that the liberal sheeple are acting in a counterproductive manner. What about the liberal non-sheeple… are they not necessarily also acting in a counterproductive manner? If so… WTF does being a sheeple have to do with things here?
Because I’m a progressive who considers the “right” a lost cause. Kinda like how a parent might not scold someone else’s child for eating cookies before dinner, but they would their own. I bash the left more than I do the right, because I care about causes and solutions that are “supposed” to be left leaning and think “the left” needs to get their shit together in a hurry
Fair enough I guess. You should realize however that a plain reading of your parenthetical comment lacks this explanation, and reads as an attack solely on “the left”.
The working class and the employing class have nothing in common… Between these two classes a struggle must go on…
Let’s go back to nuts and bolts of these strategies of identity politics. IYO is the above quote an example?
Nope, not an example. I have no problem with the employing class. I (think) I’m at heart a capitalist. I say “think” because I’m not an economics major and don’t know for sure whether capitalism must eventually lead to what we have now. I have no problem with an employer/employee dynamic. I don’t even have a problem if “the employer” makes very very good money. Those willing to take risk, put in long hours and invent new ideas deserve more pay than those who just wanna punch a clock leave work behind at the end of the day
What I’m definitely against, is the crony capitalism we have now where things have become so unfair and disproportionately lopsided that the only way to even things out is MUCH higher taxes on the super wealthy or civil unrest to take back their ill gotten gains