I forget what thread it was in, but I remember we were talking about maxing out a credit card and just leaving the country or something.
I recently got a new credit card and to maximize bonuses, I need to put a good amount on it in the first few months. I was planning around this a bit, so I had a bunch of big ticket things in the chamber ready to go. It’s been 3 days and I’ve burned through half my available credit. All charges are flying through and not even a fraud alert or anything. Seems like I should be able to pull a hit and run, if that’s what I wanted to do.
Comments suggest they got arrested. That Sovereign Citizen crap doesn’t play very well these days. Usually ends up with the occupants of the cars being dragged out the window. I do like telling someone to “kick rocks,” may have to use that…
Almost certainly nothing happened, because while these guys are POS, they are also 100% right and these border patrol agents are misleading as fuck in trying to trick you into thinking you are required to answer questions where you have no obligation to do so.
While he should likely treat them with more respect, this should go in the bad cops thread.
Longer diatribe:
Summary
This guy is 100% right that he doesn’t have to answer questions under the 5th amendment. The agents try to mislead, by saying that these checkpoints are authorized by statute - which is true, but doesn’t change the fact that you don’t have to answer their questions. The border patrol can stop you and have a consensual conversation, but again, you don’t have to answer anything. Statute can’t trump the 5th Amendment. Notice the supervisor when reading from her script doesn’t address the 5th, just that these checkpoints were found by SCOTUS to not violate the 4th, which means they can stop you and conduct a brief investigation. He agrees that is right, but it’s irrelevant to whether he has to cooperate and answer their questions (which he 100% doesn’t).
The agents know this and thus follow a script to try to mislead better. This is most evident with the orders to pull the car up and the threat that they can be arrested for not moving the vehicle. The supervisor reads from a script that says he can be arrested for impeding traffic - which has nothing to do with the situation. It’s just that you can be arrested if you stop in the middle of a roadway, etc. But he’s only doing that because they are asking him questions - he’s not refusing to move his car, he’s just refusing to move his car to where they want. And they know they have no authority to do so - notice they only request him to pull over, they never say he’s detained (which they can’t because they have no reasonable suspicion of a crime, SCOTUS has held that refusal to answer questions alone isn’t sufficient to detain).
These checkpoints are complete kabuki theatre - they are set up to harass Hispanics, but to avoid claims of racial profiling, they harass everyone. However, if you look white, all they require you to do is say, I’m a US citizen and they waive you ahead. So while he should be a bit nicer, these agents deserve no respect and everyone when stopped at a checkpoint should refuse to answer questions and tell them to “kick rocks.”
I’m pretty torn on SovCits and first amendment auditors and the like. On the one hand, they’re generally challenging law enforcement in ways with which I basically agree and they’re often correct. On the other hand they’re also usually lunatics and when you drill down you’ll find that they basically believe in their own freedom to do whatever they want whenever they want, but not for other people. And I admit that it’s just funny to watch somebody get tased sometimes.
I watch a lot of these videos (both pro- and anti-auditors) and agree. There is a huge range in auditors, with some just being POS who don’t even know the law. IMO good auditors don’t harass citizens, but only focus on cops/government employees (and not random clerks). They can also do this while being largely polite. My other issue is when auditors try to make themselves the central character, rather than trying to expose issues with police/government not knowing the law/violating rights.
My favorite auditor by far is Jeff Gray - he just stands with a sign that says “God Bless the Homeless Vets” and waits for someone to call the cops on him for panhandling (which he’s not actually doing, but is also 100% protected by the constitution). He’s always completely polite (but still assertive in his rights), and only focuses on citizens that choose to interact with him. He’s won quite a few lawsuits against cops for violating his rights.
Yeah, I think I’ve seen that guy in a video where he’s just standing with that sign on a public sidewalk outside a CHURCH being completely polite and the church people threaten him and call the cops. Yes they’re just citizens but I enjoyed that one.
They can run your license plate and tags. I guess they could use facial recognition technology.
But you’re right that they probably can’t, SCOTUS just in general only allows brief investigatory detainments.
Better wording might be to attempt to establish your citizenship. It’s the cops/border patrols burden to conduct their investigation and you have no obligation to assist. The point is they can’t then just hold you indefinitely until you give in and answer.
Yeah I doubt youngsters understand how big of an event that was. Literally everyone was talking about it. We lived in fear of nuclear Armageddon and this show ramped that up.
