Want to pitch in and say I got this wrong on first read (car vs plane) and learned something new. Cool problem.
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Yea thats what I was trying to get at. Airflow over the wings should be enough to get off the ground, treadmill be damned.
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Isnāt the lift generated by the air flowing over the wings? So with the treadmill the belt may be moving fast, but the the air around the treadmill isnāt moving at the same speed, so the speed the plane is moving to stay on the treadmill is basically irrelevant if itās staying stationary relative to the air.
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Btw Mythbusters did a full scale version of this (minus all the infinity stuff).
The planeās engines push against the air to propel the plane forward. What force counteracts that to keep the plane stationary?
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They didnāt, really. They just had a treadmill going at the takeoff speed in the opposite direction. Yes, if you set a plane on a fixed speed treadmill it will take off. But the speed of the wheel edge was twice that of the treadmill when the plane took off.
If the engines werenāt on, the treadmill would move the plane backwards, right?
In this scenario where the treadmill matches the speed of the wheels, no.
what kind of bug
yes? so if youāre on a treadmill and get pushed from behind, youāre going to move forward relative to the ground and air despite infinite legs and treadmill speed?
is the point then that the engines are producing enough force/thrust (I get that Iām probably using these terms incorrectly) to get the plane off the ground despite the absence of any relative forward movement (to the ground or surrounding air) prior to that point?
No, what Iām saying is that the plane WILL move forward. The engines produce thrust, and there is no additional opposing force added by the fact that the plane is on a treadmill.
As noted above, normal wheels/tires/landing gear would disintegrate, but I still donāt think thatās relevant to the basic reason this scenario creates confusion.
Man I want to see what alien porn looks like.
Figuring a 20 boobed Lisa Ann being octuple penetrated.
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Sure, but how does the plane stay stationary relative to the air if its engines are going full blast?
I guess Iād have to ask which air? Airās a gas so it doesnāt really make sense to treat it as a uniform object. I think the question would be how is the plane moving relative to the airmolelukes that are coming in contact with the wings to cause lift? Are the engines pushing against all the air uniformly? I donāt think they are, so in my mind the thrust of the engines doesnāt really seem to matter as far as whether they are generating lift. Right?
Inside the engines, they are pushing air molecules backwards, and by Newtonās 3rd law, they are pushing forwards on the engines, and by extension, the plane. Itās a big force. Thereās nothing remotely comparable pushing backwards on the plane, so the plane must be accelerating forwards.
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We must go on
I feel like part of the success of the question comes from the chaos it creates by getting everyone talking to everyone else at the same time. Also the rules arenāt quite clear. Feynman said the game he played was imagination in a tight straight-jacket. The question encourages people to try to loosen the straight jacket but we have to resist that.
I donāt think this would even be a question if we invested in a meaningful rail infrastructure.
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Or a return to a life rooted in soil structure
The family wouldnāt be atomized in the diaspora
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